In this week's Autoblog Podcast, Editor-in-Chief Greg Migliore is joined by West Coast Editor James Riswick and Road Test Editor Zac Palmer. This week, they've been having some fun in the McLaren GT and the Toyota 86 GT. James has spent some time with the very lovely Vintage Electric Cafe e-bike. They've also been driving the Ford Ranger and Audi S7. In the news, Ford gets new leadership, and Micro Machines are back, baby!
Transcript- Hey, everybody. This is Autoblog Podcast producer Eric here. I'm just hopping in quickly at the beginning of the episode to let you know that this episode of the Autoblog Podcast. Is brought to you by these SoFi Daily podcast. Reaching financial independence starts with having the right information. So every weekday mornings, SoFi keeps you up to date with important business news and stock market happenings and how they affect your financial life.
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GREG MIGLIORE: Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Autoblog Podcast. I'm Greg Migliore. We've got a great show for you. We've got some really awesome cars to talk about and just a little bit of news. So we're going to have some fun here. Starting right off, the McLaren GT-- I spent last night driving this car all over. I had a blast.
I just came home and sort of did the whole, like, vomiting of writing where you just have so much to say and think about that, you know, you just start writing. So I did that. I also spent some time in the Toyota '86, also with the GT in its name, ironically enough. And Riswick who will be joining me here in a moment-- James Riswick, our West Coast editor-- spent some time in a vintage electric cafe bike. He wrote on the run feet that it's damn cool. I believe him, and that's why we're going to talk about it.
And he also spent a little bit of time in the Ford Ranger on patrol with that. And then my other co-host will be road test editor Zac Palmer, who drove the Audi S7, which is a very nice car. It's been a while since I drove one, but I imagine it hasn't gotten any worse. Finally, we'll hit on a couple of news items-- Ford's CEO Jim Hackett retired. We're going to try to break down what that means or at least give you some sort of opinions that hopefully make some sort of sense.
And unless you have been hiding somewhere, you now know that micro machines are back. I am actually not that excited. They were maybe my fifth or sixth favorite, like, toy as a kid-- like, way behind Hot Wheels and even some of the, like, the larger die cast cars and tonka trucks. So maybe I'm not that excited of their coming back as I think about it. But you can get them at Target and Walmart. And if you do, you buy them through Autoblog. That's my sales pitch.
Joining me right now is West Coast editor James Riswich. What do you think of all of that?
JAMES RISWICK: Which part? Aren't we getting to that later?
GREG MIGLIORE: All of it. All of it.
JAMES RISWICK: Throw it all me, I have to start going off all ah.
GREG MIGLIORE: How you doing? Let's go with that.
JAMES RISWICK: I'm out here by myself. I'm not-- how can I be expected to weigh in on everything all at all at once? I'm not used to talking to people.
GREG MIGLIORE: That's right. You've been self quarantining for, like, when did we hire you? I mean, you've actually been working for us since, like--
JAMES RISWICK: Oh, five years now about self quarantining. So.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. So you're good and healthy. You don't need any shots because you just stay in your basement working on your monitor all day.
JAMES RISWICK: Correct.
GREG MIGLIORE: James Bond posters and what way you go. All right. Well, working with-- go ahead, Zac.
ZAC PALMER: I was just going to say, you're not in your BMW Z3 today, which is different.
JAMES RISWICK: I am not. I am not. I have installed a door in my office. That still doesn't mean there won't be an errant dog bark or anything. But you know.
GREG MIGLIORE: I feel like the dogs are really getting out of control. Like, quarantine's been going on long enough that they've decided, like, hey, I'm, like, part of your workspace now. And they've-- like, my dog is gone from, like, there and like whatever to more like a co-worker. Like, she comes around in meetings. She, like, will come sit next to me. It's like, OK. Lee the dog, you are part of Autoblog. I should get you part of the headcount, get her some health care benefits. She has pet insurance through Autoblog. Anyways, Zac, you've got the fancy blurred screen going now in Google Hangouts. That's pretty neat.
ZAC PALMER: Yeah, I saw some of our video guys with it. I was like, hey, why not? Let's try this out. Look like I had a boca effect on my screen.
JAMES RISWICK: That just makes me look-- that just makes me think that you're hiding something. That there's just some stuff going on behind you that we just cannot see.
ZAC PALMER: You have no idea what's going on behind me, so you're just going to have to live with that fact.
GREG MIGLIORE: My issue is I just turned it on, but I'm in the basement, so it's already kind of dark and foggy down here. So right now, I just look like I'm in, like, a spring morning of fog rolling in. I'm looking at myself here, you can barely see anything.
ZAC PALMER: It doesn't really work with the hat. It blurs the hat too much.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. Yeah. True. But what I should be doing is when I haven't combed my hair, which I haven't done in quite some time, is throw the thing on so, hey, then the crazy floppy hair is out there and it's still a little bit blurry. So it--
JAMES RISWICK: Doesn't help it that much.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. It's still coming up. I'll say this-- now that I have my monitor set up, I've been, like, basically avoiding eye contact for all of my calls, which is awkward. I don't always realize it, because the camera's on my laptop. So instead of talking to you guys, I'm, like, looking at here. It's like, wow, like, that's awkward, you know?
Anyways, I actually drove a McLaren last night, which is far more interesting than my hair or Google, like, Hangout's latest things, if you will. And it was pretty darn good. This was the GT. I haven't had a lot of time to fully get my thoughts in order on the car. Sometimes when you drive a car, it's totally work. You know, you take the notes, maybe you consult some spreadsheets, maybe you build a spreadsheet, or you at least write down a lot of notes.
This, to me, was the kind of car where I came back, made myself a gin gimlet, and was just starting to, like, write, you know-- in, like, the old school way that we all do this. Because on some level, I think, you know, we like cars and we're writers. And with jobs like this in the media, it's-- you know, this isn't work when you get to drive a McLaren. You know, it's really pretty cool.
So you know, hey, it was a great night, let's put it that way. I drove it all around. And I kept kind of thinking to myself, you know, how special does this feel? And, like, one of the closest rivals I kept kind of benchmarking this against was the Aston Martin DB11, which is a very special car, I think. I drove that a few years back. I went to the launch. I believe they've since refreshed it a little bit.
But the McLaren GT really-- it's got atmosphere. It's got a vibe. It's got gravitas, all those things. The GT name is kind of funny. There's a little bit of an area, like, behind the scenes, but not, like, a true Grand Touring car. Basically what I would say is this is, in every way, shape, and form, a legit supercar. I mean, you're talking about a car that's got over 600 horsepower, you know, a fair amount of carbon fiber on it. It definitely looks the part for sure. I have found McLaren's to steer and handle in a way that's, at times, surprisingly accessible.
I think I've driven Audis and Lambos and Ferraris that I've found to at times be a little more challenging. McLaren's, I feel like, you can get comfortable with, especially on the track. And I think some of that is due to the way the steering feels. They also have, generally, very good visibility, which isn't always a given in cars like this. And when you're, like, you know, an inch off the ground, I like to see what's going on around and above me. So that's my kind of monologue on the GT. Have either-- James, I'm sure in your long career, you've driven a McLaren. You've not?
JAMES RISWICK: I've never driven a McLaren.
GREG MIGLIORE: Seriously?
JAMES RISWICK: No, no. And frankly, I have a hard time telling them apart. Like, I like the GT because it's-- I can easily remember what it is. Because early on, like, it was named after its license plate-- you know, the MP4-12C.
GREG MIGLIORE: I thought that was the VIN number, right?
JAMES RISWICK: [INAUDIBLE] fax machine? Yeah. But now, you know, you have the 600LT, the 570S, the 540C, the 5-- but there's a 570GT which isn't to be confused with the McLaren GT. There's also the 600LT Spider. So I don't know. I'm happy for folks who can tell them apart, but I can't. Otherwise-- but I do like the GT, that it does have its unique name. Also, I love the fact that they're calling it a GT as you kind of touched on because, you know, it is the more Grand Touring one. It has more space in it, specifically in the cargo area. And they show this quote, "trunk," that's just, like, this long passage that-- and then they put a golf bag on it. You're like, well, yeah, I guess it fits.
But, like, you could also put a small Christmas tree on there or any other number of long things, but it doesn't really make it that functional. It's-- I just love the idea that, you know, I was going to buy a McLaren, but, you know, I just need that much more space. So here's a GT-- like this somehow fixes the issue.
GREG MIGLIORE: They act like they're cross-shopping these with, like, Jeep Grand Cherokees or something. Like, yeah, I just need a little bit more room. Come on.
JAMES RISWICK: It's like, I just need a pizza box worth more space. Oh, thank god, here it is.
GREG MIGLIORE: I will say this-- one of my thoughts was-- you're right, all of McLarens look pretty similar-- I think this is the really good looking one, though, because it's, like, cleaner. It doesn't have all the stupid crap some of the other ones have where, like-- they're like all this, like, extra carbon fiber and, like, F1 stuff that, like, Bruce McLaren dreamed up back in the '60s. Like, I mean-- and I mean that facetiously, like, you know, they're trying to summon, you know, just all of this great heritage. This is a clean looking car.
You know, it's got good looking sheet metal. The lights pop. Yeah, it's-- I think it's clean. It looks good. I guess maybe I'm the McLaren expert on this call. I actually went to Woking a few years ago and saw the F1 operation, saw how they made cars. That was back, you know to your point, James, when they were calling these cars utterly ridiculous names. And then they'd rename them like a year later and you're like, oh, well, that's the 650S. But then you'd look at the specs, it's like, well, actually, it's the same chassis and same, you know, mono-cell and the engine we just boosted and blah blah blah.
So I feel [INAUDIBLE] getting it right. And another thing that I actually found kind of remarkable about driving this car is the quality is pretty good-- at least the perceived quality. The cars are pretty well screwed together, you know? And they've only been making road cars about as long as Tesla. And yeah, that's a purposeful comparison. Tesla's cars are very hit or miss as far as which ones are screwed together pretty well.
These guys, they make them in low numbers, and they tend to make them right. So pretty sweet.
JAMES RISWICK: What color was your GT?
GREG MIGLIORE: Thank you for asking. It's Hawaiian blue. I'm not sure what the official color is, but if you think of, like, those juice boxes with the really, like, fruity punch in it, like, Ohana Punch or whatever-- it's good stuff. That was the color.
JAMES RISWICK: It's, like, literally called Hawaiian blue?
GREG MIGLIORE: No, no, no. That's just the color I'm kind of, like, comparing it to.
JAMES RISWICK: Oh. Because I'm on the configuration right now, and I'm looking at the-- there's something Lotus blue that-- or Lettuce or I don't know how you say it, but that could be it-- kind of like a light North Carolina kind of--
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
JAMES RISWICK: That's cool. That's excellent.
GREG MIGLIORE: This is the word I'm looking for-- there is a kind of pop called Ohana Punch, which if you Google it and you look at the pack, that's sort of the color of the car. And it's got, like, one, two, three, kinds of fruit in it. It's made by Fago. I'm sure there's absolutely no fruit in it. It's probably pure sugar. But yeah, that's kind of the color of the car.
JAMES RISWICK: That's nice. It's no lantana purple. because that's-- that's some-- that's some-- that's some Prince purple right there.
GREG MIGLIORE: That's the car. It was fun.
JAMES RISWICK: Going to close the configurator before I'm completely immersed in that and can't talk anymore.
GREG MIGLIORE: But yeah, long story short, it was fun. I mean, another couple of things that I thought kind of surprised me-- interior was quite nice. This one had a light cream setup. The audio was surprisingly good. That literally-- I did the cliche-- I drove around and listened to the exhaust and the engine, which I think is so trite when people say they did that. Well, I kind of did do that for the better part of two hours-- just let my mind run, you know?
I get back to my driveway and I'm like, oh, let's turn on the audio. And it's like, there's literally these amazing Bowers and Wilkins speakers on either side of me. I'm like, this is great. Oh wow, the speakers in here are amazing. And I mean, Bowers and Wilkins are good speakers, and it's a good audio system. So I mean, for a car that costs $263,000, sure, the speakers should be pretty good. But it was a little kind of a surprise and delight thing.
ZAC PALMER: It's also the GT. So presumably, you're going to be going on long Grand Touring trips in your McLaren listening to excellent Bowers and Wilkins audio.
GREG MIGLIORE: Exactly.
JAMES RISWICK: With your long, skinny--
GREG MIGLIORE: Exactly. Yes, my attache case that I take for, you know, clandestine missions on her Majesty's Secret Service.
ZAC PALMER: I'd assume that you have the bespoke McLaren luggage for it that probably costs about $10,000 to $15,000 extra. That would be the one to get.
GREG MIGLIORE: I would think how could you not get this car if you don't get the luggage?
JAMES RISWICK: When every luggage test is part-- is just like, of course.
GREG MIGLIORE: How embarrassed would you be for it? If you, like, drove your McLaren and, like, you pull up to, you know, wherever you're going to go and another guy has the same McLaren and he has the luggage and you don't, how bad are you going to feel?
JAMES RISWICK: Such a loser. Such a loser.
GREG MIGLIORE: On that note, that was the McLaren GT. I also drove the Toyota 86 GT last weekend, which was also fun in its own way. I'll be kind of brief here since this is turning into a very heavy Greg podcast, and you both drove pretty awesome cars. Toyota 86 GT-- man, I cannot get the words out today.
It was a fun car. It looks good. It's better than when it was a Scion, simply just because I feel like FRS was a weird name. And I know it had some sort of meaning. But it's a Toyota, it should have that 86 name on it, I think. I mean, the manual is pretty solid. You know, it looks pretty good.
It's the kind of thing that I feel like if I had a certain kind of commute, this could be my everyday sports car-- if I had a commute at all, for that matter. But this was always, like, the car that, like, I feel like people in the office would say, hey, if press cars disappeared and I had to get something I would really enjoy driving, this is the car I would get.
I don't really agree with that. I don't think I would really want to drive this car every day. It's a little rough. But it's a lot of fun. And I think if my commute was, like, 15 country roads somewhere from my home to the office, sure. I could probably get on board with that. But yeah, I mean, it's got great proportions.
Again, the clutch is good. The brakes were pretty good too. It's one of those things where, like, you know, the simple things like the dynamics and reflexes of a car that other brands, other cars, they cover up those shortcomings just with a ton of horsepower or a bunch of crazy styling. Toyota 86 is very pure and. That's kind of a cliche, but it's a pure car. I like it.
ZAC PALMER: Yeah. I mean, it's honestly tough to say much more about the Toyota 86 at this point. I mean, like, we've driven it 18 billion different times. It feels-- I'm definitely going to be sad-- I know we had a report probably last week that said the 2021 might be the new car. So that means this could have been our actually last drive in this generation of 86. So that's significant on its own.
I've always been in the camp that it needs a better engine-- you know, that torque valley, once you crest around 4,000, 4,500 RPM feels like it drops off a little and then comes back on later. It just hurts that sports car vibe for me. I mean, everything else is brilliant. I love the chassis, the steering, transmission. But that's just always been such a sore point for me with that car.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. I agree with that. I feel like the engine is a little bit underpowered, but I actually sort of feel like it's fine. It's adequate when you look at all the other things in balance. But it's sort of like the way the power and the torque are used that make it a little less gratifying to drive.
In some ways, I almost feel like they're doing this out of spite. Like, why can't you get it up to, like, 230 or something? You know, like, to me, it seems like they're dialing in too hard. They're doubling down too much on keeping this engine at this certain rating to maintain this idea and this notion when it's like, well, yeah, you can do it that way. But I mean, a basic Camry or Accord has, you know, x number of horsepower. Like, you can make some compromises and maybe make it a little more potent. Nice car.
This is maybe the second time I've killed a car. As I was, like, literally driving this car getting out to go drive it, I was looking-- getting the keys and looking on my phone, and I saw that article-- I think Byron wrote it-- that this may be it for this-- you know, this run of the Subaru version, which, of course, would then extrapolate that-- means the Toyota version is done too.
So last time this happened, I was in the Volt, and I was listening to the radio and they were like, yeah, they're going to end production. I was like, wow, bye, Chevy Volt. You're dead. So let's-- I don't know. If I was McLaren, I might be a little nervous-- still in my driveway.
JAMES RISWICK: [INAUDIBLE]
GREG MIGLIORE: All righty. So that's what I've been driving. There's some kind of Hyundai in front of my house-- no, it's a Genesis-- that I haven't even looked at because I've been driving this McLaren for all this time. And before that, I had the 86. I actually needed to look at what the hell this car is. It's actually a lovely car. It's the G90. So I'll get to that on another podcast. But, James, tell me about this electric cafe bike thing you've been driving-- riding.
JAMES RISWICK: All right, well, it is from a company in California called Vintage Electric. And this bike-- it's an electric assist bicycle, meaning that you pedal it and there's an electric motor that assists you. It's effectively a hybrid, but instead of a gasoline engine, there's you. It looks like an antique Indian motorcycle-- kind of like right at the beginning when these things kind of looked like a bicycle with a whole bunch of stuff in the V, which was the engine-- kind of like the earliest motorcycles. This is what this kind of looks like.
The bike is painted red-- this deep garnet red. And then the cross-bar is arched and there's some wood in it-- like, real wood. The tires are white. It is very cool. And in the middle, what looks like some sort of small v-twin engine is, in fact, the battery pack that is removable. The hub motor is in the back. Some electric bikes are where the pedals are, but, no, this is in the back.
And here's the thing about this bike-- most electric bicycles kind of top out at a 250-watt electric motor in the back. This is 750 watts. That is as significant as it sounds. Now, I have previously ridden an electric bike-- not a lot, but I have previously. And it had three levels of power. And level three, you kind of laughed at and went, well, this is silly. Why would I ever go up to level three? This has five. And that same scale applies.
Like, you don't go up to three. There's just-- you're driving around. You're only on level one. If you go up a hill or something, maybe you get to three, but you are motoring up. Five is nuts. It is absolutely crazy. You can just-- because when you move the pedals, you are engaging the electric motor. But it is kind of an off and on switch. So just by simply moving the pedals with basically no resistance on level five, you are motoring forward without, like, any, like, force back at you. It is so cool.
All of a sudden, you're going up to its top speed of 28 miles per hour, which on city streets might as well be 60. But it's very cool both from showing how cool electric assist bicycles are and making just cycling around that much more appealing. For instance, there is-- Portland, where I live, is the only city in the country with a dormant volcano within the city limits. It's called Mount Tabor. I can just go out my house and it's a significant thing.
I rode up it at 20 miles per hour on this vintage electric bike, which is roughly the same speed as you would feel comfortable riding down the mountain. So I was not sweaty. I was not tired. It just made the entire experience wonderful. The other thing is just riding around, you know, bicycling can take longer than driving a car. That's not great.
Well, with this thing, I charted out using Google Maps two points. It said that it was going to take me 25 minutes by bike to get there and it was going to take me 15 minutes by car. It took me 26 minutes by Vintage Electric cafe electric bicycle. And again, not, like, winded or anything when I got there-- so totally sold with electric assist bicycles-- and this thing being so cool looking and so insanely powerful, even better.
I am totally sold. I've let some friends ride it, and they've been blown-- one friend said she, like, that's not a bicycle. That's just something totally different. But I'm totally sold on electric bikes, and this thing's really cool. It's called Vintage Electric. I really recommend checking it out.
ZAC PALMER: This thing sounds both extremely awesome and very terrifying at the same time, riding around 28 miles per hour on a bicycle through city streets. I have one question, though-- how much does it cost?
JAMES RISWICK: Well, it costs $4,000.
ZAC PALMER: $4,000.
JAMES RISWICK: That's this electric assist thing. I thought that, wow, that is very expensive. And, sure, it is. However, that's actually-- like, a lot of electric bikes kind of start around $1,500. They're kind of in that range. But if you buy, like, a really good one from a specialty or one of the other, like, high-end bike makers, they're kind of in the $4,000 range as well. But they are not as powerful as this thing.
They kind of have that 250-watt motor, and they look-- but they also have a tendency to be made of lighter weight materials and have more fancy suspension on it. It's basically more of a modern bike. This thing doesn't have a suspension on it, and it weighs-- it weighs, like, 58 pounds-- 53, excuse me. That's with the battery.
Which means that, like, if you put it on a bike rack-- my bike rack can only take 60 pounds when it's attached to my car, which means you can only carry one bike instead of two. Whereas some of these more advanced materials ones that cost around the same are, like, 25 to 30 pounds, because they're made of fancy massive polymer carbon stuff-- whereas this is steel and wood.
So it's kind of like a retro mod. Really, I think that's the best way to think of it. So you know, pricey, but you know-- the other thing is, like, I could commute in this if I commuted further than this office. It really would make a difference because, like, one, you'd get there quicker. And two, you wouldn't get to work all sweaty and hot and tired-- especially if you have some hills in the way. So.
And the money you save on that for your commuter can go towards having a fun car for the weekend. You don't have to buy a Prius or some eco-friendly thing just to putter mindlessly to and from work. You can just get one of these for a lot cheaper than one of those mindless cars, and then just get something awesome and old for the weekend to bomb around in. So by getting a bike, you are being able to get a cooler car. And I think that's a net positive.
ZAC PALMER: I really like that line of thinking. The way you put it there, like, all right, so you don't need to buy this used Nissan Leaf to commute five miles to the office and back. Just buy this really awesome, like, old looking cafe racer-ish electric bike, and you can have a lot more fun. I feel like that would work a lot better on the West Coast or places where it's warm. Because we could only ride that, I don't know, like, five or six months out of the year here and get actually use out of it.
JAMES RISWICK: Yeah. Yeah, you also-- also if you live in a place that doesn't have, like, bike lanes or, like, bike-friendly streets, it doesn't matter. You'll still-- you're going to get crushed by an F-150 eventually. Although I will say one thing about this is being able to, like, crank it up to level five really quickly allows you to get up to speed at city street speeds. Although in Portland, like, the speed limit's, like, 25 everywhere. So that's a lot easier.
But when you're able to go-- you going 20 when the cars are going 20 to 25 is just a lot-- seems to me is safer, because they're more-- they're not blowing past you. But if you're, you know, in metro Detroit and the roads are going 60 and you're-- doesn't matter if you're going 20, you're still being blown past and no one's going to see you. So yeah, it does depend on where you live.
GREG MIGLIORE: It's a good looking bike. The only thing I'll add to this is McLaren sells bikes. They're really lightweight, and they cost $20,000. So I mean, I don't--
JAMES RISWICK: Are they powered?
GREG MIGLIORE: They're for like, you know, F1 drivers who need to, like-- they need a bike. And you know, if you're, you know, whoever and you want a bike, $20,000 is, like, $200 at, you know, Dunham's or something. So yeah, man, you get a carbon fiber bike, and away you go.
JAMES RISWICK: Can you even like-- I'm not-- yeah, and you can't-- there's no, like, yakama bike rack for a McLaren. They don't even fit those. So I don't know how you get to and from. Like, if you can't mount-- what good is your GT for if you can't mount your McLaren bike to it for your Grand Tour?
GREG MIGLIORE: It's utter rubbish at that point. You know, you've got to wait for the McLaren SUV or the McLaren, like, Bronco fighter. You know, you got to see that sort of thing.
ZAC PALMER: Yeah, I guess you just laid out the business proposition for a McLaren SUV right there, James.
JAMES RISWICK: Yeah, they're own their own bicycle. Or oh no, can you-- can you get-- well, maybe you-- can you get a tow hitch on the back of a McLaren GT? Can you get the thing on the back? Right? I'm sure you--
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
GREG MIGLIORE: Pull your sod, your mulch, I mean, right? The funny thing is this is actually the business case, like, every, like, automaker makes when they rationalize why they need to go into SUVs is, like, well, our buyers find that they're buying-- they're going to other brands instead of, you know, staying with us. Like, really, Bentley, do you think people buying the Ben Tyga, like, they're really, like, going and hauling mulch on the weekends? I don't think so. I think you probably didn't need to go down that road.
But hey, that's what they do. I mean, so it goes. And if I ever see a trailer on a Lambo Urus, you know, I'll buy you guys a gin gimlet. How about that Ford Ranger, which probably could haul some, you know, wood chipper too? How do you feel about the Ranger? I feel like the last time we had you on the podcast and talked Ranger, I feel like you didn't like it, James. But I could just be totally making that up. So what do you think of the Ranger?
JAMES RISWICK: No, it wasn't me. No, I like the Ranger a lot. I think it's interesting, and I kind of agree with what your overall conclusion was on the comparison test, which it won-- was that it's not really good-- it's not really the best at anything, but it's just really good at most things, which kind of makes it well-rounded. It's not as peaky as everything else.
So like, you know, like, the Chevy Colorado has really good ride and handling and pretty good engine. But the interior is pretty crummy. And if you want to take it offroad, you have to, like, remove the lower air dam so it doesn't get ripped off by a low hanging, like, anthill. But then, like, the Jeep Gladiator-- extremely cool looking, can go absolutely anywhere, but then, you know, it costs, like, what, like, $95,000 once you put options on it?
GREG MIGLIORE: It's basically McLaren fighter at that point.
JAMES RISWICK: Yeah. So, like, all these other-- they all have significant downsides to them. And the Ranger really doesn't. And I think that. I think that just makes it pretty broadly appealing. If there's only one thing I would say is the fact that you can't get it with a longer bed-- crew cab with a longer bed. That's something that the Tacoma and the Colorado offer. And you know, I brought a workbench over to a friend's house, and it barely just fit in there. You have to drive with the tailgate down, which isn't unusual.
But with a five-foot bed, it would be nicer if they offered that. That's kind of its main pain point as far as I'm concerned. And also the back seat is only one solid piece. It's not a 60-40 split like everything else. So you can't sit somebody back there and use it for, like, carrying their bags to the airport, which-- you have the bed, but what if it's raining or something? So a couple of tweaks here or there could make it that much better.
And perhaps that's the kind of thing that because, you know, the frame and the mechanicals were pretty much new for America, the body and the cab on everything-- that's the same from Australia. So maybe with, you know, a bit more interior advanced-- more budget going to the interior in the next generation truck for the American market, maybe that's the type of thing that we can see. That would be that much better.
GREG MIGLIORE: I do like the Ranger, and I actually think it's-- unlike, say, the Ridgeline I drove a couple of weekends ago, which is just fine to drive-- it looks cool. It's a truck, sure, great. I think the Ranger does have a fun factor, especially with the FX4 option. I think that gives it kind of a bouncy jouncy vibe. And it gets a little bit closer to, like, oh, hey, the Gladiator, I'm psyched to drive. Like, a TRD Tacoma I'm psyched to drive. I think with the, like, the Ranger, it's not quite that fun. But it gets you a little bit closer to the point where like, oh, hey, I have this truck. It's fun to drive. I'm enjoying it.
So you know, I'm generally with you. I like the Ranger. Again, it's not my favorite, but it does everything pretty good in that segment. You know, all the other trucks have some major shortcoming.
JAMES RISWICK: The other thing is-- one thing I like about it is-- you know, you can look at the price, and certainly, especially, the expense-- the fully loaded ones start to run into F-150 territory. And there's definitely an easy point to be made, like, why am I getting the smaller one when I can get the big one for roughly the same money, especially given how much they're discounted?
However, the Ranger is not just, like, a kind of smaller F-150. They're very different to drive. It is more of like, a-- I always think it kind of feels like it sprung from the-- sprouted from the same branch of the family tree as more of their crossovers in feeling than like the trucks, just in terms of the way it steers and handles. And the other thing is it's just its size. If you live at all in a urban environment, like, driving a full-size truck is very difficult. And you know, just to find a parking spot, you're always worried about, you know, narrow roads and hitting some guy in a vintage electric bicycle with your tow mirror. You don't have to worry about that with the Ranger, or with any of the mid-sized trucks, actually.
So there is a reason that you would desire one. It's not just because, well, I can't afford the big one. Well, maybe you don't need the big one. Maybe just what this provides is enough. So I kind of like the divergent purposes of the two trucks that Ford sells. And then once-- you know, inevitably, you can imagine them making a Gladiator fighter based on the Bronco and that bringing in more of an offroad focus, different styling. Like, you can see a family of different trucks emerging with their own separate, totally viable purposes and customer bases.
ZAC PALMER: I think that's a really good point you made about how it feels a lot smaller and better in all the urban environments that you take it through. The one time I drove a Ranger through a city, it was actually enjoyable. Whereas you drive an F-150, Ram 1500, those things are chores to drive through small areas and whatnot, whereas the Ranger was-- hey, I'm sort of high up.
You know, this has taken all of these huge potholes. It's kind of fun-- feels agile. Whereas an F-150 is just, like, this gigantic beast of burden that you're like, oh, I'm trying not to hit this car. Oh, I'm trying to squeeze through this spot. And the Ranger, you just kind of squirt through everywhere, and off you go.
GREG MIGLIORE: I could not agree with that more. I was literally about to say that, because the last time I drove a Ranger, I took it to a farmer's market. And it was Eastern Market here in Detroit, one of the oldest farmers markets in the country. It's pretty tight quarters. You know, you're talking about century-old side streets. Ranger was no problem. You know, it could see over everybody. It was fine on the expressway coming home.
But, like, maneuvering through, like, literally people hauling carts of food, people with, like, you know, all their groceries and their produce and things like that-- it's no problem. You don't have that, like, wow, can I see over the side of my mirrors, or I can't see this corner of the truck, you know, or, oh, jeez, I need to back up. You know, it's like-- it definitely fits the need. And when I think about what would be, like-- would I rather drive 80% to 90% of the time, it'd be the Ranger versus an F-150 for just, like, stress free, this is what I'm going to do-- not that driving an F-150 is crazy difficult, but there are practical implications of it, so. And I got a car seat in the back, so that worked out OK. It was pretty tight.
It was quite tight, in fact, let me put it that way. But it's doable. It's not as comfortable as, say, a big crew cab F-150, though. There you can put, like, probably three car seats across the back and away you go. So. Audi S7, how was that, Zac?
ZAC PALMER: I like this car a lot. I spent a good deal of time staring at it and also driving it. To me, you know, the draw with the A7 and S7 has always been the way that it looks. You know, it's this super long, low-slung sport back. It's elegant, but it's also sporty. This was the S7, so it's especially sporty with its appearance package and big exhaust tips coming out the back.
And I've always been partial to hatchbacks, which this thing has a gigantic power hatchback that, you know, when you open it up, you have this huge space to just chuck everything in there. Now, it's not as great as a wagon-- an A6 Avant, the new all-road that's coming here definitely has more space. But this is a really, really great happy medium between the A6, where this car is based off of, and an A6 Avant.
But you know, like you said, I had the S7, so I also spent a good deal of time driving this thing. Took it to some fun roads. So this one-- when they went to the new generation of A7 here, they-- for the S7, they swapped from the V8 to the V6-- so went from the twin turbo 4-liter V8 to this twin turbo 2.9-liter V6. And it sort of almost feels backwards. You know, everybody putting more and more power into cars, but the new one actually has slightly less horsepower, slightly more torque-- still very fast.
You know, I've driven this engine in the Macan Turbo and the RS5 sport back. It's a real sweetheart of a V6-- sounds good. Mine had the sport exhaust on it, actually-- makes the chainsaw ripping sound with every single gear shift. It's actually a bit much for the type of car that it is-- pops and crackles everywhere.
So a bit of drama there if you want it. You can also turn everything into quiet mode and act like an executive and cruise around silently. It's super, super comfortable. That long wheel base definitely helps it out there. You know, it's typical Audi quiet cruising around the city. Just, you know, overall, a super, super pleasant situation. You're sitting there, you got your seat massagers on. You got the fragrance rolling through the climate control. It's all very calming. And you know, the actual tech in this thing is one of the biggest draws as well on the interior.
I love Audi interior design. I think they've just been, like, utterly killing it for a long time now. Like, there hasn't been a bad Audi interior. And I think this just continues it. You know, I haven't really liked dual screens, but this dual screen setup works really well in this thing. And there's just awesome little tech features everywhere. Like, the electric door handles-- just kind of barely, you know, use your finger on it and, boom, the door pops open. It's almost Tesla-like in the fact that you just kind of, like, press a button and, oh, the door is already moving.
Mine had the-- I think it was the $5,000 Bowers and Wilkins audio system in it, just like your Bowers and Wilkins in the McLaren, Greg. But this one has tweeters that rise out of the dash. And you know, they're, like, 3D sound. So look super cool there. I mean, even when you're just pressing the unlock button, you have this extremely awesome tail light and headlight sequence that it goes through-- feels very high tech, almost as it could appeal to, like, a Tesla buyer-- you know, somebody that wants, you know, all of the gadgets, all of the lights, all of the fancy extras.
And you know, it-- on top of that, it handles pretty well too. It's definitely better on long sweepers because this thing feels heavy. It is heavy. But they actually added rear-wheel steering to the car this year, which helps it feel a little more agile. But you know, it's still not going to be a sports car in any way no matter how much technology you throw at this super heavy beast.
You know, there are a few options that you can go with here. Mine was $100,000 for that money. You can get yourself, like, a CLS53, a Panamera that's kitted out pretty nicely. You could, you know, even go for a BMW 8-Series Gran Coupe if you wanted four doors. I would definitely take the Panamera for the ultimate performance.
But this Audi-- if you're, like, somebody who loves tech, feels like the choice right along there with the Mercedes, they're almost neck and neck. I don't know if you guys have any favorites in this class as well.
GREG MIGLIORE: I tend to more skew towards the CLS.
ZAC PALMER: Yeah.
GREG MIGLIORE: Just tends to be-- frankly, I like the looks a little bit better. I feel like Audi started to really crease their cars up a little bit too much, design's a little bit too busy. I don't know, it feels like they're trying a little too hard with other cars.
JAMES RISWICK: Yeah. I mean I agree with-- like, I think the old A7 looks better. I think the new A7 looks like kind of like what happened to the TT, where they go, wow, we really knocked it out of the park on the first one. How can we possibly update this? Let's just kind of update it to our new styling language. Let's just-- and in this case, just put a bunch of creases and sharp angles everywhere. And it's just not as clean and elegant.
I don't really like Audi's new interior design. I think it's very kind of cold and severe. There's a lot going on. I kind of like the old one. There's a lot more, like, organic. Both materials in it-- there was, like, the beautiful matte finish, open pore wood.
In the A7, it kind of had the wrap-around wood trim behind the dash that kind of, like, Jag introduced with the XJ. I really like that look. Also kind of like MMI better than the dual touchscreen thing-- although I have not used it that extensively. But I am-- I'm with you, Greg. I like the current CLS better. I actually liked all the CLS's. They've all been wonderful cars.
Actually, interestingly enough, those three cars, they all look very different. The CLS is not-- it is more-- there is more difference-- they did switch things up from generation to generation, whereas the A7, they've just kind of added sloshes and stuff to the current one-- more of an evolution.
GREG MIGLIORE: Good example. Go ahead, Zac.
ZAC PALMER: I was just going to say, like, it kind of sounds like you guys don't like the the design of the A7. And honestly, when I first saw it in photos, I didn't really like it that much either. But as it's sitting there in front of me on the driveway in the S7 trim, which has a bunch of, you know, the silvery gray parts on it-- the mirror, the front fascia-- it really grew on me more over, like, a week long.
It's got this sort of, like, sporty vibe, but at the same time, also feels elegant like the old one, because it keeps that shape. Maybe that's a factor that seeing it in person-- I don't know.
JAMES RISWICK: I like it. I don't dislike it. I just like the old one better.
ZAC PALMER: That's fair.
JAMES RISWICK: I just think they-- it just didn't really need to be-- it's like a sequel to a movie that didn't really need to be made kind of thing. It's like kind of the same. We were fine with the first one. But seriously, the old one, they could have just, like-- if you wanted a new interior, they could have just kept selling the old one, it was such a pretty car.
But I think that's the problem with doing something that's so-- because the TT is a good example for the A7. Because the A7 wasn't just a pretty car, but it was so influential throughout the industry. Like, Byron right now has the Hyundai Elantra for 2021, and that thing has the same shape as an Audi A7. So does the Hyundai Sonata. The Honda Accord looks like the Audi A7-- the same kind of-- even if they don't-- the Malibu-- like, even if it doesn't have the hatchback, that was an incredibly influential car. And following that up, that's a hard task-- and possibly even an impossible one. So for what they had, it still looks good.
GREG MIGLIORE: I could kind of picture the press release in, like, 2023 or something when the next gen, you know, like A7 or S7 launches-- it's going to be like, Audi he goes back to the design that, you know, made this car such an icon with cleaner sheet metal and-- you know, like, literally, that's how they'll spin it. It'll be like a return to heritage versus oh, yeah, maybe that last look was a little overwrought. But, yeah.
The sequel that didn't need to be made. I like that line. That'd be a great subhead maybe for-- maybe not for your story. That's probably a little too negative for a car that overall is pretty good-- just talking about the design.
ZAC PALMER: I like the design, so I wouldn't--
GREG MIGLIORE: Oh, yeah, that's right--
ZAC PALMER: Headline either.
GREG MIGLIORE: Zac and I-- or James and I have been, like, kind of not liking this for so long on this podcast that I forgot that you liked it about five or 10 minutes ago.
ZAC PALMER: I do.
GREG MIGLIORE: That's OK. I mean, like, yeah-- so it goes. Let's talk some news-- pretty newsy week. One of these items is super serious, one of them is not. So I guess we'll go serious and end with micro machines. But kind of quickly here-- Jim Hackett, CEO of Ford, steps down. Jim Farley, former marketing boss-- I think he ran Ford Europe. He's done a lot of things for Ford since he joined them from Toyota back about 12, 13 years ago-- kind of has been a rising star for a few years-- takes the-- you know, takes the torch as Ford faces a lot of uncertainty, really.
Personnel can get a little dry. If you're listening, you probably know who these guys are. You probably don't know a ton about either one of them. I think Hackett's tenure was marked more by the fact that Ford tried to, like, go headlong into some pretty big bets, if you will, to sort to use the jargon that, like, you know, I don't know, leadership people like to use. And the fact is, is they don't really pay off.
Like, he even kind of admitted, hey, I thought autonomous and electric, like, mobility would get here a little quicker than it did. And oh, hey, it's not exactly here yet. Killing sedans, so to speak, was kind of controversial. You know, he gets to leave sort of in the glow of the Bronco and the Mach E, which is good. You know, but I don't know, it's kind of hard to necessarily say Ford is in better shape than it was when Mark Fields got fired, you know, three years ago.
I don't know, I always kind of thought Hackett would stick around about this long too. I think he is turning 65. It sounds like the plan, so they've said, was for him to leave next year, and he's just kind of moving it up. I mean, I don't know, read into that what you believe. I mean, the point is he was in his mid-60s. He probably wasn't going to stick around much longer anyway.
He already retired as CEO of a furniture maker. And for some of you who listen in the Midwest, he was actually the University of Michigan's athletic director for, like, three or four years. So he's a former U of M football player, believe it or not. So he's done a lot. At this point, in some ways, if I'm 65 and I've done all that, I'd be done running a car company too.
I think the big takeaway here is what's Jim Farley going to do. He's a strong personality. You know, he's said some kind of crazy things. He was quoted in a book once about saying he wanted to beat General Motors with a shovel. And you don't hear that a lot out of the C-suite here in Detroit. So that's the shakeup, and that's kind of really the breakdown too. I'm just-- more than anything, I think at this point, where do you think Ford goes from here?
JAMES RISWICK: I think Ford has always been good when its products have been good. You know, back six years ago when they had their big product push with the new Focus and the new Escape and the new Fusion, I was recommending to everyone I knew all those cars, because they were the best things in their segment. And over time, those got older, and inherently, they had nothing to replace them with.
I think that product reason was a big reason for Ford's decline in recent years, because it's about the product. And when they can make truly competitive, innovative things that they're absolutely capable of doing, then they will be strong. And if the Bronco is any indication of what we can expect from Ford going forward, specifically the clear amount of effort and thought and resources that went into its creation as well as the Bronco Sport, then I think things can look quite positive in the future. And I also throw in the Mach E as well, because I think that's a very good idea for both a vehicle perspective as well as a marketing one. People don't like the Mustang thing, but I think having its own sub brand is actually quite smart.
ZAC PALMER: Yeah, I'm pretty excited for what Ford is up to here. I mean, Farley, he's been in this industry for a long time at this point-- very different CEO than Hackett was. I mean, like you said, he worked at a furniture company for the vast majority of his career, whereas Farley, he's worked at multiple different car companies. And now, you know, we have this guy taking over at Ford.
I honestly do wonder if him and Hackett diverged at all on the idea of getting rid of the Focus and the Fiesta and the Fusion and the Taurus and all of those. And you know, it leaves some doubt in my mind, like, maybe one of those will return. Or maybe they'll return in some different version than they left at.
But it gives me some tiny hope that maybe Ford could have some fun cars again. We keep getting ST crossovers-- Explorer ST-- or Explorer ST and Edge ST would be awesome to have-- you know, another GTI like competitor-- Civic SI. just thinking out loud here-- who knows if any of this is going to actually happen? But maybe Ford will hear me.
GREG MIGLIORE: Well, one thing, too, to your point there, Zac, Farley is a big car guy. Like, when I was doing more launches-- I went to the Boss 302 launch at Lagunaseca quite a while ago. He was there. And, granted, he was more like sales boss or something then. But he's definitely one of those cliched, like, oh, he has high octane blood or something. You know, he's a hardcore enthusiast.
I'm sure Hackett liked cars too. But to your point, you know, he was CEO of Steelcase. They make, like, furniture. You know, and I think it obviously is an enthusiast website. It doesn't hurt when you see enthusiasts running car companies. It doesn't mean they're going to do a good job. You know, sometimes just being a good manager and minding all the different, like, you know, spreadsheets, that's the way to go.
Alan Mulally was a plain guy, and he did a great job with Ford. He was a great ambassador. He made a lot of tough decisions and did a good job. Then they brought in Mark Fields who was more of a marketing guy, and they kind of treaded water. Boom, he gets fired whenever he retired at the age of 52 or whatever he did. And then, you know, they bring Hackett in-- not a car guy. OK, kind of treaded water. They did some big, splashy things, but didn't necessarily get where they wanted to be.
And then, you know, Farley to me is the kind of guy who can run Ford for 10 or 15 years. He's only in his 50s. You know, and that's-- when you see people like that, that's where you start to think, well, maybe he ends up being one of those more transformational CEOs, you know, who starts to, you know, not only sort of service the Autoblog reader, which loves all the different Mustangs and exciting cars and Broncos, but also you get to be somebody who is a little more like, you know, transcendent, who really becomes, like, a global sort of leader, which is kind of cool.
I find it interesting when CEOs, especially in the auto industry, become-- sort of attain that status. I think Elon Musk is there for good or ill. I'm not sure he's the best spokesman for the industry. I think Mary Barra is a very good spokesperson for the industry. So we'll leave it there. That's the insider "Game of Thrones" that is Detroit CEO suites.
But micro machines are back. At first, I was pretty excited about this. Then I actually thought back. I was just going through my parents' basement, I don't think I even kept my micro machines. They're, like, little cars that are, frankly, choking hazards for young children. They're not really my favorite toy, as I now think about this. James, you probably remember these, actually, as being a toy. How do you feel?
JAMES RISWICK: Yes, I sure do remember them. They were very popular toys when we were children. And they were prominently known for a man who talked really quickly and described them while on commercials.
GREG MIGLIORE: Thank you for the keeping the podcast short by talking quickly. If only your Ranger review could have been that fast.
JAMES RISWICK: Yeah, I didn't like them when I was a kid. They weren't as detailed as the regular cars-- like, Hot Wheels or matchbox. And since I lived in Canada, I got majorettes from Europe. They were fun too. But yeah, I never really got the point of them. I didn't really have, like, extreme space needs for my small cars for transportation purposes. So I didn't really get them. And yeah, in retrospect-- I was an only child, but if I had some younger sibling who came along, those micro machines all of a sudden are a horrible choking hazard. So yeah, I didn't really get them. I am happy for people who are really jazzed about their return, though. Good for you. But no, that doesn't really--
GREG MIGLIORE: They disappeared for a good however long. You know, I mean--
JAMES RISWICK: Long enough for Zac not to remember them.
ZAC PALMER: I don't remember at all. I was into Hot Wheels and matchbox, just like you said. And honestly, as I'm looking at the story of their revival, they don't look nearly as cool as they used to be, which, you know, they used to be actual replicas of cars. So you could get, like, a Camaro or a Corvette or whatever. Now, they're just, like, indistinguishable, generic vehicles. And it's like, that just takes even more of the appeal that I never really had away from the actual product. So yeah--
JAMES RISWICK: I guess they also came in, like, different sets. So, like, you could have a whole, like, elaborate play set with them. Maybe that was kind of their appeal. It was more than just having a little car. I don't know. If I didn't get it when I was eight, I don't think I'm going to get it now.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah, that's kind of how I'm at. If I remember right now, they're sort of like when you were tired of playing with your Hot Wheels and your LEGOs and then any other car you had. It was like, oh, hey micro machines are this different car thing. They're kind of cool, something else to get excited about. But yeah, I mean, they're, like, really small-- hard to, like, see, like, what you were doing. You know, and when you're a kid, you have good eyes. So--
JAMES RISWICK: Oh, I know what-- oh, OK. So have you seen "Home Alone," Zac?
ZAC PALMER: I love that movie.
JAMES RISWICK: The little things he puts on the floor to make Harry and Marv slip, those are micro machines.
ZAC PALMER: Really?
JAMES RISWICK: Yeah. So that's probably their moment in the sun right there.
ZAC PALMER: I never put that together. Big feature spot for micro machines.
GREG MIGLIORE: So on that note, send us your Spend My Money. We're going to start closing podcast segments like this where we talk about bad toys from the '80s and then see which other staffer who's slightly younger doesn't know what we're talking about. That's right, send us your Spend My Moneys. Please, send them to us-- even if it's a bad question, it's got to be better than this segment. I guess we'll leave it there, guys. This was a fun show. Be safe out there. Enjoy your late summer. Hopefully have a great weekend. Micro machines are back. We'll see you next time.
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