Filed under: Trends, Sedans/Saloons, Tech, BMW
BMW M5 shifts old-school
Purists will rejoice at the news that for 2007, BMW is offering its lightning-quick M5 with a manual transmission.
Although the 500-hp super-sedan is capable of some jaw-dropping supercar-territory performance (like hitting sixty in 4.1 seconds), some enthusiasts have bemoaned its excessive use of electronic systems that interfere with a direct connection to the road.
With the no-cost option of a six-speed manual instead of the seven-speed sequential SMG gearbox, the M5 isn't expected to be any quicker. In fact, with clutchless manual transmissions always improving, the switch to the stick may in fact slow the car down a bit, especially in the hands of the average driver.
The news opens up the debate all over again: stick or paddle? If you were buying an M5, which would you take?
[Source: Kicking Tires]
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
cars specifications 7:25AM (11/07/2006)
No doubts that I'll chosse an six-speed manual gearbox.
http://www.auto-power-girl.com/cars/bmw
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Jason 7:38AM (11/07/2006)
If by "Purist" you mean someone who might actually want the mose performance out of a vehicle. Then the paddles are the choice, The DSG has already proven to be faster by at least a few tenths fo audi/vw. The Automated manuals (these are true manual transmissions folks) can shift and match revs better than any human driver ever could and they'll do it consistantly.Theres no loss of connection you're still doing all the work, just rot rowing them yourself. Keep your clutch pedal, ill take what F1, Ferarri, and Audi and already figured out is better. Paddles are the way of the future, tripedalists are a dying breed in an age where the automated manual is simply better.
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Catelu 7:51AM (11/07/2006)
We'd all like to think we'd do better with a manual, but I'm affraid the paddles are the right choice for most of us. Of course, in an M5 the small price premium doesn't really matter.
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Ignorant 8:04AM (11/07/2006)
I think people choose manual over automatics because of the involvment in the driving. They don't want to be 0.5 seconds quicker to get to work.
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overtorqued 8:12AM (11/07/2006)
I agree with 4. It's just more fun to work the clutch and rev match yourself. Any monkey can mash a gas petal and go fast if a computer's doing the real driving for them. I think those that chose fun over convenience will stick with the stick.
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tekkenking 8:36AM (11/07/2006)
4 & 5 got it right, people buy stickshift because they want to be more involved in the driving experience, automatic 0-60 times have been withn .5s of manual ones for years, that's just not the point.
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Rick Reimundez 8:46AM (11/07/2006)
I'm with 4, 5, & 6...
Yeah, not arguing that if I were on a race track, or my life depended on that extra few tenths of a second that I would go with the paddles shifters... It's clear from a performance perspective that it would be better.. But from a feel, and personal enjoyment perspective, I like rowing my own gears. Will it be a little slower?, yes.. Will it perhaps not be as smooth? - with me driving, probably.. But it's just more engaging.
It's sort of like some of the old VW fans. The guys that are fans of the Mk1 and Mk2 Golfs and Jettas don't love their cars because they are faster than a modern car.. because they are far from it. But when you have a nicely tuned suspension on a Mk2 VW, there's nothing more fun that tackling some twisties.. Even if it'll be embarrassed both at a stop light and probably in the twisties by your neighbor's new Camry.
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pd 8:47AM (11/07/2006)
Stick all the way. In everyday driving stick is better, for track work the SMG is better, but how often are you at the track?
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Kevin White 8:54AM (11/07/2006)
First of all I'd be getting a 3 Series coupe, not the M5, but definitely a traditional manual. When I start dragging or racing my Bimmer, I'll consider the quicker shifting transmission. Usually not much shifting in Autocross...
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roadster 9:07AM (11/07/2006)
4,5,6,7,8 obviously understand why some want a true old-school manual. When you are talking about a car that's this capable it's not about ultimate 0-60 or track day performance, it's the enjoyment of the driving experience in total; M5's are driven on the street 99.9% of the time. BMW lost focus of what the "ultimate driving machine" really is to it's core customers. Forcing customers to drive an electronically-controlled transmission that wasn't what they wanted flew in the face of the "old" BMW. Now with a proper manual transmission for the driver who wants more involvement with driving, BMW should make i-Drive optional as they do with the 3 series. Because it's also the fly in the ointment for purists, and takes the joy of driving away. BMW should offer gizmos to those who want them, but they also have to make their cars appeal to the very people who made them so popular in the first place; people want smart design, balanced and superior performance without needless gizmos. "The Ultimate Driving Machine" wasn't merely an advertisement, it was the core of the brand to the faithful.
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sr20de 9:12AM (11/07/2006)
I agree with the people above me- the involvement with driving is important to me. I would buy the 6-speed. Also, what about long-term reliability? I'd imagine a 6-speed manual is far less complex than the flappy-paddle system.
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Joe 9:13AM (11/07/2006)
#2, you obviously have never sampled BMW's SMG. It's slow, jerky clumsy and awkward. I've never tried DSG, but from what I understand, DSG is an entirely different technology that relegates it to the scrap heap. BMW knows this and it's why the company is developing their own dual clutch technology
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Adam Singer 9:15AM (11/07/2006)
Manual all the way. Plus, the SMG is supposed to be a horrid gearbox.
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Jason 9:22AM (11/07/2006)
I strongly agree with #4 and #5. We have a 545i SMG and an M3 manual. Both cars are fast/quick in their own rite. And given the performance/luxury slant of the 5, the SMG is acceptable as a means to become more involved in the driving process than with an automatic transmission.
However, everything is different in an M car. The tuning, tolerances and tightness of the entire system immediately offers a different driving experience. The feel of accomplishing match revs and balancing the torque during off-the-line starts cannot be compared with simply commanding such an incredible machine to do the same.
We all know that you can go fast in any of these cars, and it isn't a matter of quickness measured by a stopwatch while on public roads that brings us the thrill and excitement ... it's the experience. For me, I'll take an M5 with a manual transmission please.
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G. Snyder 9:28AM (11/07/2006)
Kevin - there is no SMG in the 3 right now, so I am not sure why your comment is relevant.
I think the stick offers more involvement, but a lot of you are ignoring the fact that the clutchless manuals are also pretty involved. Most will not upshift on their own, letting you bounce against the rev limiter. The SMG, in particular, is not well suited to being left in "auto" mode either, so you still have to choose the right gear for the situation. Lets not forget that there is also an extra one of those in there for the SMG (7 vs. 6), not to mention the myriad of settings you can choose from.
Again, I think the stick is probably a little more involving, but you all need to not act as if the SMG is like a traditional automatic either. I have driven an SMG II (not the III in these cars) and the DSG, and I drive a stick shift car every day, so I have basis for comparison.
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G. Snyder 9:38AM (11/07/2006)
roadster - you may want to do a little research on what iDrive really was for. It was designed to support some of your purist visions, not work against it. I am not sure how it is that people bash the iDrive. I guess it is those who refuse to read manuals, but most simple car functions are duplicated (twice over in some cases). The reason for the iDrive was to remove the myriad of buttons that would be required to control some of those things that get in the way of "pure" driving. A lot of the menu choices are aimed at things like disabling DSC/DTC. There are other car makers out there that think you should not be able to do this - be thankful that BMW has allowed you to take control. Would BMW be competitive if it did not offer a lot of these dynamic driver aids/features? Surely not. Anyway, it was not long ago that people were bemoaning the array of buttons on the dash (even in the days of your pure BMWs - E34, E36, E46, etc.). I think people like to complain - in particular about things they do not have. I imagine anyone that owned an iDrive equipped BMW would in a very short time become quite accustomed to it. It is not going away, though - and it is only optional on the 3 because of the desired price point. Once the generation that can't work a VCR dies off the complaints will stop.
Now, as for the SMG - if BMW is in the business of providing cars that are all about driving dynamics and performance, and the M variants are their most "balls to the walls" cars, then why would it be out of character to use the best performing transmission possible? It is not contradictory at all. Their "lesser" cars (if you can call them that)have transmission choices for the row your own folks.
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Den in IN 9:45AM (11/07/2006)
Well, if it makes any difference to know of a vote cast with considerable dollarage, I know of a SMG equipped M5 sitting on a used car lot after being traded for the first 6 speed M5 the owner could get his hands on. Hated the SMG from day one after a series of manual M5s over the years.
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voodoobru 10:08AM (11/07/2006)
stick all the way and for the same reason i wouldn't by a video game that plays itself.
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MikeW 10:28AM (11/07/2006)
How much does it cost to replace the engine?
When will BMW improve the engine? The M5 engine is weak, considering the Lamborghini has 512hp@8000, 376ft-lbs@4250, runs nearly a centimeter smaller bore, and only a 11:1 compression ratio, has variable resonance intake manifold and dual length runners. That is the world beater engine.
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Chris 10:29AM (11/07/2006)
Stick...I'd probably never drive the car hard enough to justify the DSG. Not that I'd be able to afford the car to begin with.
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