In this week's Autoblog Podcast, Editor-in-Chief Greg Migliore is joined by Consumer Editor Jeremy Korzeniewski and Senior Editor, Green, John Beltz Snyder. They're thirsty this week, but first, they talk about the Subaru Forester and Lexus NX they've been driving. They dig into the news about the Toyota Corolla Cross, Audi Q4 Sportback E-Tron and J.D. Power's surprising Initial Quality Study results. A longtime Autoblog Podcast listener suggested our editors try to relate some of their favorite beers to their favorite cars, and they happily oblige. Finally, they help a listener choose a new car in the "Spend My Money" segment.
Transcript- Hey, everybody. This is Autoblog Podcast producer Eric here. I'm just hopping in quickly at the beginning of the episode to let you know that this episode of the Autoblog Podcast is brought to you by these SoFi Daily Podcast. Reaching financial independence starts with having the right information. So every weekday morning, SoFi keeps you up to date with important business news and stock market happenings and how they affect your financial life.
So get your money right and search for SoFi-- that's S-O-F-I-- wherever you get your podcasts. On with the show.
[THEME MUSIC]
[ENGINE REVVING]
[CAR DRIVES AWAY]
GREG MIGLIORE: Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Autoblog Podcast. I am Greg Migliore. We have a great show for you today on this hot, sizzling Thursday afternoon in July. Joining me today is senior editor for all things green, John Snyder. What's up, man?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Hey. Just trying to beat the heat with some iced coffee today.
GREG MIGLIORE: Sounds good, sounds good. My coffee is just cold because I haven't microwaved it in a while. And chuckling at that remark-- charitably, I guess-- is consumer editor Jeremy Korzeniewski. How you doing?
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I'm doing good. I-- I mean, unlike you guys, I stopped drinking coffee about an hour ago. It's-- it's well after noon, guys.
GREG MIGLIORE: Well, it's afternoon, which means we should talk beer, which we're going to later on in the show.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: 5 o'clock somewhere, right?
[JOHN AND JEREMY CHUCKLE]
GREG MIGLIORE: It's 5 o'clock somewhere in Europe, right? They're five to six hours ahead of us. So yeah, I mean, if you're listening to this somewhere in the UK-- of course this isn't live, but hey, in London and in-- you know, Rome, Berlin, Paris, it's-- it's later. So yeah, have a drink.
But anyways, we are going to talk about beers and just how they sort of relate to different cars. This is a segment that came in from a longtime "Autoblog Podcast" listener. We thought it was a great idea, because we kind of do this anyway during, like, every show. So we thought we'd make it a little bit of a casual segment, and maybe more of a recurring thing, sort of like the trivia we do occasionally, and of course, "Spend My Money," that we try to do as much as possible. So we will have a "Spend My Money."
The cars we've been driving-- the Lexus NX, I spent some time on that. John has been basically subleasing a Subaru Forester for most of the length of the pandemic. But he did take it in for some service and stuff like that. So you know, hey, that's-- you're earning, you know, your salary, I guess, servicing the cars.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES]
GREG MIGLIORE: So that's in the drive-slash-review section. We'll hit on some news topics. The Toyota Corolla Cross-- it looks pretty interesting. I think it-- we'll dig into that a little bit. The Audi Q4 E-Tron Sportback. And then some interesting numbers out of the JD Power Initial Quality Survey. A couple of unsuspecting brands are near the top. If you are on our site or have the magical power of Google at your hands, you know what they are. But we'll tell you, basically, our theories why Dodge and Kia scored so well.
Again, then we'll talk-- talk some beer, and we'll spend some money, and away we'll go. So that is-- that's the show. You guys feeling good?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Feeling good.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Feeling great.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right, all right. Sounds good. Let's kick things off with the Forester, long-term update. John, just, what have you been doing with this thing? Tell us about some of the ins and outs as far as the-- any service stuff. And yeah, what's up with this Forester that I have not seen since early March?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Well, I've been putting a lot of highway miles on it. I've been spending a lot of time going up to our cottage up north in Ocqueoc, Michigan, sort of in the middle of nowhere. And so there's a lot of highway miles, a lot of dirt roads.
I've found that, you know-- I did-- I did a comparison between this and the Outback that should be publishing anytime now. And man, I'd much rather have that Outback on the highway. But this thing is great f you're driving around in the city. It feels really good on the-- on the dirt roads, too.
And I found it's really, really easy to clean up. I'm dragging a ton of sand in every time I get in this car. And we've got the rubber floor mats, the rubber cargo mat in back. And pretty easy to reach everything with the-- with the vacuum. So yeah, it cleans up really, really easy, a lot easier than a lot of other cars that we've had. A lot of other long-termers can get a lot of nooks and crannies with it. But yeah, stuff just doesn't really stick to this car inside.
But yeah, on the highway it's been-- it's definitely an improvement over the last gen. It's-- it's quieter. It handles a bit better. I like the longer wheelbase of the Outback better, just for stability on the highway. This Forester, it gets a little twitchy. It's definitely one where you want to keep both hands on the wheel pretty much all the time. None of this "laid back with a hand at the top of the steering wheel," because it just wants to-- you're just making too man corrections.
But yeah, I've been really enjoying it, taking it through-- deep into the woods here and there. You can see outside really well. So I-- I keep spotting turtles in roads, and saving them, moving them out of the road on these country roads, these back roads.
And then yeah, I've been taking it back out in the woods, shooting, the last couple of times I've gone up north. And that flat cargo area is a great place to sort of reload magazines and-- and you know, do quick-- quick cleanup on your guns if you get some sand or dirt in there. Yeah, so it's a pretty good-- pretty good car to drive.
It does beep at you a lot. We tested the-- the facial recognition thing for Tech of the Year. And even with that off, you're still getting tons and tons of beeps. Because this thing wants to move around in its lane, any time you get near the edge of the lane, you start approaching it, it's beeping at you. And passengers who are-- who aren't used to it are like, what's going on? Is the car OK? You know?
So but overall I've been really enjoying it. It's a great car to throw, you know, a bunch of stuff in-- you know, tents, dogs, coolers, and hit the road, and get out in-- into some of those hard-to-reach places.
GREG MIGLIORE: I feel like it's really good for, like-- sort of like couples or maybe families with, like, one kid. I feel like anything more would be a bit much. Like, we-- we took the Forester to a tailgate last fall. And we basically filled it-- comfortably, mind you-- but about as full as it would be. And it was three of us-- four of us, because the dog went. If there had been, like, a second child in there, it would have been really tight, I think.
You know, we put the coolers in the back, the dog leisurely stretched out across the front. You know, we had the car seat, my wife in the back. And it just-- you know, you need a duffel bag. You take some food, you take some beer, you take maybe a football, wherever-- wherever it is you're going.
I'm pretty sure I've taken this camping, maybe even hunting, if I recall, now that I think about it. In fact, I did last fall. And that was just me driving up to the UP. And it was like-- the UP is the Upper Peninsula of Michigan for those of you listening along.
But yeah, it just-- it fills up quick. I feel like the Subaru Ascent is almost like the-- like the family-sized vehicle, if you will, that you kind of need to step up into.
Because even just like-- you know, we were-- you know, before we had our son, driving around in the Forester, you know, it-- it fills up quick with two people, you know? And it's like-- that's my sort of take on it. I feel like there's other-- it's more of a segment thing than a knock on the Forester, if that makes sense.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, that makes total sense. And another thing you get with the Ascent is something like 19 cup holders. Which-- [CHUCKLES] I'm a man of many beverages. I've always got--
GREG MIGLIORE: Oh, yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: And you are too. You've always got, you know, a few different things on your desk. You know, I like to have tea, I like to have water, I like to have a Diet Coke, sometimes, you know, La Croix. [CHUCKLES] And then my wife's the same way. You know, she'll have a coffee cup, a bottle of water, and you know, something else.
And so-- [CHUCKLES] yeah, they fill up quickly. But the-- but the Ascent, yeah, definitely it's-- it's a three-row. So it's-- it's definitely-- you know, especially-- even if you're not using that back row, it's better. I still think there are better-- if I were-- if I were going up to that size in the segment, I would think I would maybe look at some of the competition. But if you're a Subaru loyalist, which a lot of Subaru people are, moving up from, like, an Outback or a Forester into the Ascent makes perfect sense.
GREG MIGLIORE: We-- yeah, I think we could easily fill up those 19 cup holders. Because I often have an espresso going, like, as the lead-off. Then I get into the coffee mug. There's always a big water bottle going-- not always Nalgene. That's generally the-- the province of, you know, the Snyder family. Often a La Croix. Yeah, I mean, you've got to stay hydrated. That's for sure.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: You got to plan your day. [CHUCKLES]
GREG MIGLIORE: Exactly.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Especially on those long drives.
GREG MIGLIORE: Exactly. And after you said country roads maybe five minutes ago, about your adventures, literally I stopped hearing anything for about five minutes, and heard the John Denver song, which really gets stuck in your head, I think, easily.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: You know, I've been sing-- I've been humming the John Denver "Take Me Home, Country--" since John said country roads. Like, exactly like what Greg just said. Like, I can't get it out of my head now.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: And now all our listeners are doing it too.
GREG MIGLIORE: Right, right.
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I mean, I've got to say I'm picturing myself in an Outback, not a Forester, down that country road, I got to say. But yep, me and John Denver.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: We'll have to do pairing cars with-- with music at some point.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yes.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Extension to the beers thing.
GREG MIGLIORE: I feel like it's too trite to take the Dodge Journey and give it Journey, "Don't Stop Believing," even though it fits so well.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Well, it finally-- finally stopped believing after two, 2020.
GREG MIGLIORE: It's true. It's true. Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: The journey ends.
GREG MIGLIORE: And Steve Perry left the band, the journey ended. Yeah, so I guess it's retired. You're right.
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
GREG MIGLIORE: Maybe give it a secondary Journey song, more like "Any Way You Want It" or "When The Lights Go Down in the City" for the Dodge Journey. And then save "Don't Stop Believing" for something that's, like, just absolutely epic.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: How about just horsepower for Dodge? Dodge does not stop believing in horsepower.
GREG MIGLIORE: There you go. There you go. Anyways, let's see. I'll talk about this car I've been rolling around in. That's the Lexus NX, which is-- I got to tell you the color this thing had. It is cadmium orange, which seems like something you would get, like, a Cadbury Easter egg maybe. It kind of looked like an Easter egg. It was more like a metallic, bright orange, sort of like an orange La Croix if you can picture the color of that can.
This is actually the 300 Hybrid. So, you know, it got pretty good fuel economy, 33 in the city, 30 on the highway. You know, it's always hard. It's an inexact science to kind of get that down. But yeah, I'd ballpark it, sure, and say it got about that in my travels.
Mine snickered for $50,555. That's not cheap. I feel like there's other things in this segment I would take before this. This has the 2.5 liter motor with the hybrid-like, you know, components.
I would say, from a looks perspective, I like this. It's divisive, it's sharp. That front end is almost, like, knife-like.
But I'll say this-- Lexus styling is aggressive. It's almost, like, a "like it or hate it" look, which I think is actually a gutsy play for a brand that's so ubiquitous. You know, I mean, when you think of a-- a luxury brand that just is like-- like, it's everywhere, you know, I mean, I feel like, you know, if you're looking for a premium luxury car, Lexus isn't going to be wrong for most people, you know. An Audi might be. A Cadillac might be. You know, there's a number of brands that don't really fit your style. An Alfa Romeo certainly is wrong for a lot of people.
But Lexus, to me, is like, you know, the vanilla ice cream, if you will, as far as just its ethos. You know, that being said, they've done a lot in trying to make their cars, you know, really track-capable, really dialing in some of the-- you know, the steering, the chassis, that sort of thing. Putting some wild-- you know, that 5.0 liter V8 they've dropped in some of their cars is really impressive.
So you know, there is a performance bent that I think they almost don't get enough credit for. All that being said, this is a pretty good hybrid SUV. Brakes-- this is like the third or fourth strait Toyota I've driven that I've hated the brakes, because I was in the Prius and I was in the Land Cruiser.
So I mean, different brakes for different reasons. But you know, hybrid, and then, like, that old-school off-road feeling. But it's-- it's not a great dynamic, I'll say that.
I do like that Lexus is bringing hybrid capability to the segment and to the, like, you know, SUV buyers. I think that's a good thing. But it was a pretty generic, off-the-shelf hybrid too. There was nothing about it that I thought really-- you know, well, honestly I almost didn't realize it was a hybrid the first time I just drove it to get some takeout. Then I was like, oh, yeah, I've got the H. OK.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, the-- that hybrid system, you know, Toyota, with the Prius, it's been around for so long that they've really got it sort of dialed in. And you know, it feels pretty seamless. You know, it feels like a normal car. You're not really thinking about it being a hybrid, except maybe when you're stepping on the brakes.
And I-- I think that-- I quite like that, quite a bit. I-- I also am the kind of person who really likes when the hybrid aspect is in your face and, you know, it challenges you to-- to, you know, drive it like a super-economy car, like hyper-miling and stuff.
But this-- this, you're just supposed to forget about it, and then just enjoy when you go to the pump less and-- and spend less on gas. But yeah, it's pretty seamless. And-- and yeah, they know what they're doing with that. They've got it dialed in for sure.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: You know, when the NX first came out-- gosh, what was it, five years ago, something like that-- I'm not looking at it in front of me-- but I actually did the initial first drive when that car was-- was launched. And it's gone through changes since then. So this isn't like, you know, completely up to date.
But at the time, I remember thinking that the hybrid, for-- you know, as far as I was concerned, was the way to go. Because you know, I just-- I can't imagine a bunch of people going out and buying an NX, looking for a performance bent. Like you know, they don't-- like if you're out, going for-- shopping for, like, a performance-oriented crossover, I-- I don't think you're shopping for-- I mean, first and foremost, probably not a Lexus, and not a Lexus NX.
And to Greg's point, Lexus does deserve more credit for its performance offerings, but-- but not performance crossovers. You know, they just-- that's not what they do. They-- they do some-- some really great coupes and sedans. Pour one out for the GS, which is--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: That-- I mean, the GSF is a-- just an epically good car to drive with that--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: It's amazing.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: --truly aspirated V8. But yeah, but getting back to the NX, I just tend to think that people shopping in that category aren't really concerned about the-- you know, the turbo rush of their daily commuter. And that being the case, the hybrid just suits that car's personality, I think.
And I like the technology behind it too. You know, if I'm driving-- if I'm choosing a hybrid, I'm more like John. Like I want something to stand out to remind me that I'm driving the-- the hybrid, battery-powered option. But Lexus and Toyota deserve credit for producing something seamless, that is so technologically advanced. Like for instance, the NX, the whole rear axle is electrified. You know, there's no power connection from the front-wheel drive powertrain to the rear axle. And yet it's an all-wheel drive vehicle that, you know, is-- that-- I just think that's cool. Like--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: For-- for a while there--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: The Toyota--
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Go ahead, John.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: The Toyota/Lexus hybrid system is-- is really slick.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES] The all-- the all-wheel drive-- the way they've implemented the all-wheel drive in these cars is-- it's really clever and-- and very efficient. It-- yeah, for sure.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, the-- the term's not used very often, but-- but you know, in the early days of hybrids, you know, 2008, 2009, people were referring to something as a through-the-road hybrid. I.e., there's not a connection from the-- you know, the gas to the electric.
This isn't exactly that, because the-- the whole front, with its, like, super-clever, you know, gearing and electronic CVTs and all that that, it has that, but it's also kind of a through-the-road hybrid with the rear-powered axle, which is an electrified-only, which is a really cool thing.
And-- and that-- you know, that packaging allows them to spread that drivetrain technology across a much wider path-- like, swath of vehicles. They-- they have all-wheel drive Priuses now. You know, and it-- and that started with this NX, with the-- the powered rear axle, which I think is, like, a cool thing that-- that they don't get enough credit for.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, agreed. Yeah, it's-- [CHUCKLES] I drove that-- that Prius on the launch. And I drove it in the snow. And it was-- it was really good. And you're-- you're sacrificing very-- very little in terms of the fuel economy for-- [CHUCKLES]. And, like, it's sort of turn-on and turn-off at will. It's great.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah. And the packaging of it, I think, is the coolest part. Because there doesn't have to be a drive shaft going from the front to the back. You know, and that's, like-- that's always been the-- the gotcha of having an all-wheel drive system, is how do you get the power from the front to the back without in-- you know, infringing on passenger space?
Well, here's the solution. You know, hybridize it, put some batteries in, and electrify the rear axle. It really takes care a lot of the-- the packaging constraints, and allows them to take that technology and spread it a lot-- you know, across a lot more vehicles.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: And then you don't get the efficiency losses, the parasitic [INAUDIBLE] from having to send it all the way through the car. Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: It's smart. It's-- and I mean, and they deserve-- they deserve credit for doing it.
GREG MIGLIORE: You-- I almost don't need to be here. You guys, I think, broke down the car better than I did in many ways.
One thing I would add, too, is I wasn't a fan of the steering, primarily because I generally like Lexus steering. I think it's generally-- you know, to use the word, the phrase, "dialed in," as we've-- we all keep dropping. I think is generally pretty good in their cars.
In their SUVs, especially the NX, I was not loving it. It seemed like it was a little artificial, and just wasn't really what I was looking for. It's hard to knock the steering in this segment. You know, like, you're not going to really get a great-handling crossover this size. But you know, that was, I think, another thing I didn't really like.
Interior was pretty nice. Lexus interiors are very solid. Yeah, I don't know-- side footnote, it was great for picking up takeout because you can hit the button, hatch goes up, they put the food in your car, hit the other button, hatch goes down.
And I don't understand why, like, every car doesn't have that. You know, is there anybody who wants to have to have their car in park, or with the engine turned off so you can sweat or freeze, or better yet, jump out of your car? Like, this just to me seems like a feature that, yeah, maybe you pay a little more for it, but, like, why don't cars have that? It just seems so obvious, you know?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, it's definitely-- I-- I've been using that feature a lot in-- you know, the-- the Forester has it. And it's just a great, easy way to-- you know, if someone's bringing you something, or you know, loading up a bunch of stuff in the car, you know, if the driver doesn't need to get out, they don't need to get out.
GREG MIGLIORE: Cool. So I think that's enough on the-- this Lexus SUV, which is pretty nice. I enjoyed it. Let's talk about, staying in the Toyota family, the Toyota Corolla Cross. My first reaction when I saw this, this morning, over my first cup of coffee, was this looks like a Hyundai.
I don't know. Just the grill, the headlights-- to me, I was like, wait a minute, what am I looking at here? But I mean, it makes-- I think it makes a good deal of sense. You know, the-- in our story, Jonathan Ramsey, one of our freelance writers, used the term, "Corolla meets SUV," which I think sums this up pretty well, actually.
And I think it's smart to use the name on a thing like this, just because there's only so many good car names out there. You might as well try to cash in on Corolla. In this article, Jonathan also kind of details the history behind usages like this, like the Corolla All-trac. So go to Autoblog. Check it out. You can see the pictures and get some of the specs which kind of explain this, you know, far better than we could do in an audio format. But it will be, like, genetically related-- related to the CHR. So with that, what do you guys think?
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: OK, I'll kick this off if you don't mind, John.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Go for it.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: First comment is it is smart to use the Corolla name. And that's something that Toyota has, like, been really good at over the years. They-- they've been able to bolster their Corolla sales numbers for as long as I can remember by basically rolling everything under the Corolla umbrella. You know, even things like the Toyota Matrix, which is so very-- very clearly not a Corolla. But you know, hey, it's a Corolla.
So yeah, just like being transparent with it, and calling it a Corolla Cross, I think, is-- is good. That's good marketing. And it's going to, again, help them, you know, spread their-- their Corolla net over a further swath of buyers.
I don't like the CHR. I think it's-- it's way too styled-focused, and-- and sacrifices too much utility in the process. Corolla, to me, means utility. Like, that's the most utilitarian compact vehicle that you can buy. So you know, the idea of a compact crossover in the Corolla vein, it just seems like such a smart idea. I can't believe it took them this long to do it.
And I'm shocked that they came out with the CHR as kind of like this "front-wheel drive only" hatchback, kinda sorta, like, crossover-ish thing. It's shocking to me that they came out with that before they actually did this, like, you know, "this just makes sense" move of the-- the Corolla Cross.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, 100%. Yeah, I-- I 100% agree with you. I was on the launch for the CHR. And we were all just kind of like, what is this thing? Like, I mean, it's funky, for sure. But man, I don't know, the-- this Corolla cross just seems like the better buy, you know, across the board. And we get a-- we get a hybrid too. So, which-- you know, the-- the CHR, you know, you'd have to live in one of the other markets like-- I'd see them in Japan, but I-- you know, didn't offer it here. So there's-- there's a lot more options with this, and there's a lot more justification, I think, for-- for buying the Corolla Cross than-- than the CHR. Yeah, the CHR can go away.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah, I wouldn't disagree with that. I think-- you know, sometimes you get-- we're seeing this, like, really just prevalence of smaller, crossover-type vehicles with kind of funky styling, just, you know, they're-- they're reproducing like bunnies.
And I think, sometimes, it's like, you know, maybe you sort of like-- if you're Toyota, you look at your portfolio and say, what's the strongest hand we could play? What's the best foot we can put forward, if you will, and go with that. You know, who knows. We'll see what they do.
So yeah, I don't know. I mean, my guess is, in a normal, like, economy, where people are out buying, you know, smaller SUVs, something like this badged a Corolla will probably sell pretty well. I think it's going to be tricky to launch stuff like this now. But we are seeing a little bit of a return to normalcy as far as the, you know, the auto market, although, you know, obviously it's-- things have started to swing back a little bit. So I mean, I guess we'll see.
I think it's enough on the Toyota Corolla for this podcast. John, you wrote a piece on the Q4 Sportback E-Tron that was revealed this week. Looks like it's going to head to production. Looks awesome. The E-Tron Quattro I drove, I want to say, last spring, was amazing. And this sort of fills out that E-Tron family a little bit more.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah. This shows that they're doing-- you know they're going to do the same thing, where, you know, we've seen with other crossovers, where they make a crossover coupe version of it. But this is in the realm of electric.
I think it's going to get a little tricky with the nomenclature. They're probably going to have to rename the regular E-Tron-- [CHUCKLES] to something else. But yeah, this is basically, you know, the Q4 that's coming out, this is the-- the E-Tron version. And then there's the one with this chopped-up back roof. It's considerably more busy in back, in my opinion, but I think it looks kind of cool. It's also a lot more slippery than-- than the non-Sportback version. So they're able to make it a little more efficient with the-- with this better drag coefficient. They had to put that rear spoiler pretty-- pretty high up. And so there's some glass even under it to see out.
The designer said that, with this, he got to break away from some of the other-- the typical Audi-- he said stiff-- design. There's a little more curves going on here. I'm not sure how much I love it or not. I-- I really like that sort of architectural Audi styling of most of their cars that's very conservative but very structural. This has more going on. But I think where it does have things going on, it's-- it's interesting. It's eye-catching for sure.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. That's-- I mean, I think that's, in some ways, where we were talking a little bit earlier. No, I'll let you finish your thought. Sorry. I just randomly jumped in.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: No, go ahead.
GREG MIGLIORE: I feel like Audi, you know, that styling will make it the right, like, luxury vehicle, in addition to its green credentials, for some people, you know? Whereas I think sometimes the Lexus-- Lexus is another example, maybe Acura, of brands that are just-- like I-- you know, like I said earlier, a little more generic, a little more ubiquitous as far as their broad appeal, even though both of those brands arguably also have very strong, even divisive characteristics in the styling departments.
But yeah, I mean, this is going to be cool. I think, you know, the more they can do in the E-Tron space, I think, is really going to really, you know, I'd say make Audi more of a leader among EV companies. This is how you can sort of-- you know, sort of throw up a bulkhead against Tesla and some of the new, like, companies that are emerging.
You know, I was talking about Nikola, which is doing, like, hydrogen fuel-cell semis, earlier this morning. You know, Rivian Bollinger-- I think if you're, like, an existing company, you want to tell people, hey, stay home. Let's-- we can give you an EV. You don't need to go to Tesla. You like Audi. You want four rings on your grill. Stay with us.
So-- so yeah, irrespective of nothing, that's my kind of random thought.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Well, yeah, Audi's giving people-- eventually, once these start coming out, they're going to have a ton of options in terms of body styles with-- with electric, you know, powertrain running it. Yeah, they're going to have the GT-- you know, there's just a lot going on. And there's even, you know, different versions of the standard E-Tron, sportier versions.
So I'm-- I'm interested to see what they-- what they do. They're going to keep coming out with different E-Tron. There's going to-- you know, the next one, or the GT, I think, is coming out on the new PPE platform, same as the Porsche Taycan.
There'll be-- it'll be interesting to see, you know, how-- how these bleed over into the Volkswagen and Porsche parts of the family too. Because these are all sort of modular platforms that can be shared across the brands.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Right. And I think that--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Go ahead.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Well, I think that's-- that's kind of like the secret sauce to, like, the VW group's, like, push into electric vehicles. It's-- it's like-- I don't know, it almost reminds me of back in the 1960s when Volkswagen took their very basic air-cooled platform and-- and just, like, spread it across everything from Beetles to Things, to vans, to squarebacks and fastbacks, and sedans, and, you know, everything.
And this-- I mean, obviously it's not exactly the same thing. But with platform modularity the way that it is right now, they can take this-- this electrified powertrain, their battery technology, their motor technology, and they can take, like, the broad strokes of it and apply it across, you know, the Volkswagen-- the Volkswagen brand, the Audi brand, the Porsche brand. You know, like, a lot of the-- the technology that-- that you know is-- is debuting right now, we're going to see it over, and over, and over, and over, and over again. And they're going to use, like, software and, you know, limiting battery sizes to-- you know, to-- to differentiate the vehicles.
And we mentioned, you know, to get to the Q4 Sportback E-Tron-- specifically the Q4 Sportback E-Tron-- and-- and can we take a moment to, like, discuss how naming conventions are getting so difficult these days, especially from the German car companies? This is the Audi Q4 Sportback E-Tron concept.
Anyway, I actually like the way it looks. You know, we were commenting earlier on Audi's kind of like, you know, their-- their design language, which is, you know, like-- I don't remember exactly what you referred to it as, John, but like-- kind of like, "OK, sure."
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES] That's-- that's what the designer said.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah. What I-- what I like about it is, like, they're-- they're playing to their historical strengths but also modernizing it. Their historical strengths like, you know, people of a certain age-- our age, specifically-- think back at the-- the Audi Quattro coupes with the big, muscular fenders. And they're spreading that along their lineup.
If you think back to the luxury car companies, Audi was kind of the first one to-- to branch out into, like, the big, prominent grill also. And they're carrying forward with that, except they're-- they're giving it, like, that cool, like, high-tech look now. Instead of a big air opening to feed a radiator, obviously that's not needed anymore, so we're going to make it look really techie, with these, like-- like, you know, architectural sort of, like, lines, and-- and, like, the metallic coverings and stuff on them.
I don't know. I think it's cool. And it's-- it's exactly opposite to what the market leader, Tesla, is doing, which is basically removing grills, and just kind of like putting the outline of where the grill would be. You know, Audi is doing something different, and they're saying, like, yeah, this car doesn't need a traditional grill, but we're going to take our-- you know, our history, and our styling, and we're going to modernize it, and make you know that it's different, but it still, like, matches the rest of our-- our lineup.
So I don't know, I think it's really cool. I think, you know, if they can actually turn this concept into a production vehicle, and just, you know, tone it down a very slightly bit, but still make it stand out like that, I think they're on a good path.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Agreed.
GREG MIGLIORE: Sounds good. So speaking of someone on a good path, how about we talk about Kia and Dodge, who had a strong showing in the JD Power Initial Quality report that just came out. Jeremy, you wrote the story. Why don't you go ahead and take us through it.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah. I think the-- the big shocker of the report was Dodge. Like, I-- I was on the conference call when they were announcing the-- the rankings. And the first thing I did when I saw them is post them to our little online communication channel that we use for the Autoblog editors.
And I just said, you're never going to guess who's leading the JD Power Initial Quality study. No one guessed. And that's because you don't-- we don't think of-- you know, FCA, as a brand, being, like, the leader of quality. There's a lot of good things going for FCA, with the Jeep and Dodge brands specifically, but you know, initial quality, probably not what we would have thought.
But when they started breaking it down, it made a little bit more sense. The first thing that-- that people who are listening to this are probably thinking is, look, of course Dodge is doing well because they've been making the same vehicle for, you know, a decade. And there's truth to that. They-- they've been able to take their couple platforms that they-- they use, specifically the Challenger, Charger, Durango platforms. And you know, at this point, they've got to be-- they'd have to be doing something really wrong if they weren't able to get it right.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES]
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: And there's truth to that. But digging a little bit deeper, they're giving their customer base exactly what they want. They're putting their high-horsepower, naturally-aspirated, and supercharged engines in everything that they've got. And who hasn't asked for more power? So you know, Dodge buyers are happy to get that.
Looking even further, their Uconnect software is excellent. And you know, if there's one thing that-- that JD Power has kind of gotten criticized for a bit is for hanging so much of their quality, reliability, and dependability rankings on the quality of vehicle software. And there's some truth to that, because the software's updated constantly and changing constantly. And it's-- it's upgradeable after the initial purchase. So something like initial quality, that is tested after 90 days, well, that stands to potentially improve without any hardware updates as the owner brings their car into the dealership and the software gets updated, upgraded, et cetera.
But credit where credit's due, Dodge and FCA as a brand, their Uconnect software has consistently been some of the best that-- that is out there. And looking through the numbers a little bit more, you see that there's very few Japanese brands in-- in the top. Like, after saying, like, you're never going to guess who's leading, the second question is, you're never going to guess who the top Japanese brand is. There's only one top-- there's only one Japanese brand in the top 10, and that's Mitsubishi.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES]
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Who saw that coming, right?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: But again, it-- it kind of goes to that, like, what are the customer's expectations? What is it that-- that this car company is-- who are they marketing to, who are they selling to? And knowing the audience, I think, is important. Mitsubishi knows their audience, and they know how to deliver the product that their audience-- that their customer base is looking for.
Scrolling through some of the other leaders, Dodge and Kia tied, with scores of 136. And just breaking that down really quickly, that means 136 problems or issues reported by owners per 100 vehicles. So that's-- you know, that's greater than-- than a 1-to-1 ratio.
And that, again, goes to show they're not based in these rankings on vehicles that die in someone's garage or they don't get them to work in the morning. That's not what these rankings are for. Because very, very few brand-new cars have that kind of problem. What they're saying is, oh, I had a problem or difficulty connecting my Apple iPhone to the Bluetooth and listening to my podcast in the morning. That ranks as a problem. Someone who has a hard time figuring out, you know, their navigation directions, how to input something, that goes as a problem.
And-- and they're telling. Like, you look at the-- the more-- the most luxurious brands out there, you know, BMW, Mercedes-Benz, Cadillac, Acura, Porsche, Audi, you-- you see that those brands that offer the most technology and the most complicated systems are the ones that rank poorly.
So it's an interesting list. It's-- I've long thought that this is the kind of list that you have to take with a grain of salt. Because you know, it's-- what are you-- what are you basing your quality rankings on? Is-- if the transmission dies in the first year, is that a bigger, you know, sign of overall initial quality than I had trouble connecting my Bluetooth? It is, for sure.
But if you take the rankings is what they are, like a snapshot into the mind of a car buyer in the first 90 days of ownership, they're useful. And you know, I'll just leave this last parting thought before I let you guys comment on this. This is the first year that Tesla was included in the rankings. And you can guess where they finished.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES] Yeah, that was wild to see that. You know, they didn't-- Tesla didn't give JD Power permission to survey their customers, but they did anyway. And yeah, they ended up last. That doesn't totally surprise me with the issues and things that have to go back to the service right away. Customers have long complained about that part of Tesla ownership.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Right.
GREG MIGLIORE: I'm intrigued by owning a Tesla, just because I feel like, a Model 3, I see a lot of them on the road, or a Model S, which I actually think is the better, more beautiful car. But the actual ownership experience worries me. You know, like I feel like we've all made that big purchase that you-- like, you want it, you're excited. You get it, and then it's like, oh-- oh, it's kind of broken right out of the box. Or you do something wrong, and then you're, like, recalibrating while at the same time still experiencing some dissonance. You know, like, well, it's OK. I'll do it this way. But then you're like, this isn't as good as I wanted it to be, you know? And that's, like, literally my biggest concern about owning a Tesla.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, that's-- that's a funny thing. You know, we were-- like, getting back to what I was, like, cautioning our-- our listeners or readers about the JD power, is like, take it for what it is. I think the caveat is Tesla. Like, they're the-- they're the ones who are breaking that-- that rule.
Because owners of-- like new owners of Teslas, they're not having trouble connecting their Bluetooth. They're having trim pieces fall off. Or you know, a rear seat that isn't-- if you-- if you follow, like, Tesla owner groups, which I do a little bit, because, you know, it's an interesting topic to me. And I know some people who are in the market for new Teslas. Even my brother is considering buying a Tesla to replace his current Audi. And so I'm following this-- this kind of thing. And, like, the issues that-- that people are complaining about in, say, a Lexus, is they don't like the input method, you know, the joystick, or little mouse, or touchpad, whatever it is, for the infotainment.
People who are complaining about Teslas are saying, like, you know, things like, I got the car and the trunk wasn't lined up properly, or you know, the-- the rear bumper fell off when I drove through too deep a water. Or a lot of people are seeing issues currently right now where their rear seat isn't properly-- like the base of the seat isn't properly attached to the rest of the vehicle. And the seat is made to be able to pop out and, you know, access all the stuff that's underneath it. But people are getting the cars, and the seat's popped out already.
Like, that's the kind of thing. Like, if you're judging initial quality, well, of course Tesla is last if they're delivering cars with seats that aren't properly attached or, you know, with-- with you know, trim that's falling off, or body panels that aren't aligned right, or imperfections in the paint directly from the factory. That's not what other car companies are getting judged on, but that's currently what Tesla's getting judged on. Which, cut them some slack, they're-- they're really new. And building cars at this level isn't that easy.
But then the flip side of that argument is Tesla, as a brand, is currently worth more than any other company in the world. So with that kind of, like, money and-- and expectations behind it, they've got to be able to screw their cars together.
GREG MIGLIORE: I went to a-- sort of a teardown of a Tesla, I want to say, Model S about a year ago. And it was done by sort of a local intelligence engineering, like, analytical firm here in Detroit. And their conclusion was, like, underneath-- underneath the skin, you know, the electrical components, all that-- all that stuff is, like, next-level, how good they are at it and how sophisticated they are.
But then the gentleman who was sort of doing the walk-around was like, just the actual, like, coach-building part of it, which you know, we've been doing for 120, 130 years-- there's nothing new there; Tesla doesn't really need to reinvent that-- he's like, this is, like, so shoddy. You know, it's like there's gaps. It's like, it literally could depend on the car you get, you know. So that was, like, his big sort of takeaway.
I remember the stories, at the time, were pretty controversial. Because I can't remember if we actually did anything or not on it. Maybe we talked about it on the podcast. But I know, some of the-- like, the daily journalists in town did stuff. And it was very controversial because people were like, what are you-- who's this guy? He's going after Tesla's, like, quality and stuff. But you know, he was like, yeah, it can be really good. It can be really good on a car-by-car basis. It could be really good on a part-by-part basis. So it was-- it was interesting.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: You remember those Lexus commercials from the 1990s when they-- they'd start the car, they'd run it, they'd put it on this, like, pedestal, and then they'd put a marble-- oh, not-- no. No, they'd-- they'd put champagne glasses on the hood while the car was running and show how smooth it was. And then-- and then they'd-- they'd take marbles, and they'd run them down the panel gaps, showing that, like, everything is just right.
That's the exact opposite of what we're seeing with Tesla. Like, you start the panel-- or you start the marble test in the panel gaps, and it eventually falls through one of them because the gap got really big. It's like exactly what the Japanese premium brands are going for is screwed together so perfectly and, you know, the pinnacle of reliability, which is-- you know, that's kind of Toyota/Lexus.
Tesla's the opposite. Like, we're going to stretch the boundaries. We're going to do-- we're going to take the technology as far as we possibly can, and we're going to consider all of you guys beta buyers, like, until we get this just right. You know, like, it's-- it's the exact opposite-- the exact opposite, like, ethos of-- of car manufacturing.
And I think, if buyers know what they're getting into right off the bat, then great. But I do think, getting back to JD Power, the fact that they're polling these Tesla owners and Tesla is getting worse scores than everyone else, tells me that not everyone who goes out and buys Tesla knows exactly what they're getting into.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah, I agree with that. I think that's really good analysis, and on such a high level there, by an experienced senior editor. I think we should transition to something equally as erudite. How about we talk some beer?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES]
GREG MIGLIORE: It's a nice-- that's a weird transition, but, hey, Jeremy's, like, you know, really laying out this, you know, top-notch analysis. And I'm like, yeah, we're gonna-- let's throw a little bit of a happy hour here. But anyways, the--
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I love beer. I'm all for it. I'm in.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right, all right. The idea for this came from longtime podcast listener Todd Love. Thanks for writing in. Thanks for listening. And thanks for all of you out there who are longtime listeners, and maybe have ideas like this.
Basically what he wrote in and said was, hey, you guys talk about beer fairly semi-regularly. Why don't you actually do a segment on it? So since this is a segment about beer, we didn't watch script it out too much. I'll give the standard disclaimer. If you're enjoying a beverage, please do it at home, you know, or a designated driver. All that sort of, you know, disclaimer. We're not advocating anything of the illegal or, you know, not-wise variety here. But if you're on your patio or on a Zoom call like we are, talking cars with a couple of your buddies, then by all means.
So the thought process here was, what sort of cars, or vehicles, or trucks, or SUVs relate to a specific kind of beer? I threw this email to you guys last week. And man, like, this is some in-depth reporting here by John Snyder. He's got, like--
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
GREG MIGLIORE: Like, I hate to break it to you, but we're not going to win the Pulitzer for a podcast segment on beer. So--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Right. [CHUCKLES]
GREG MIGLIORE: But still, needless to say, way to steer into it. So why don't we do a round robin, each kind of go off with a couple of ones that just kind of came to mind. This was almost as much like a mental exercise as it was any sort of, you know, let's get really metric about it. But John, why don't you give us a couple of yours. We'll start there.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: OK, so I sort of-- yeah, sort of like if this was a pairing-- I thought about it in a couple of different ways for some of these. Like, some of them, this beer is this car. And some of them are like, "this is the beer that I would want after driving this car" sort of thing. But most of these are like, this beer relates to this car.
I'll start with the Mercedes GLS. I picked the Odd Side Brewing Mayan Mocha Stout. It's a fantastic, very robust stout, very large in flavor, and sort of a lot going on. And yeah, but they make a bourbon-barrel-aged version of this Mayan Mocha Stout. It's got-- I should say this has habanero in it, and chocolate, and it is just super good.
So the bourbon-barrel-aged, you take the GLS, which is this robust thing, aged in burble-- bourbon barrels. And you get the-- the G class, probably an AMG version that's very hot and very big, and offers a lot, and it's very robust and flavorful.
GREG MIGLIORE: It's interesting, Odd Side Ales, they do some far-out things. I'll just-- like as the name implies. But go ahead, Jeremy.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Oh, no. I-- I like where John went with that. Like, you know, you take the-- you take the practical one, which, I mean, no one's calling the Mercedes GLS practical. But compared to the G class, it makes a heck of a lot more sense. Like, no one's buying a G class because they're hauling their family and kids around. But you know, wealthy people with the means, they buy GLSes to-- you know, as their-- as their family vehicles. But you kind of, like, flip the wick a little bit, and light things up a little bit more by bourbon-barrel aging. And you know, suddenly, like, OK, the connection between the GLS to the G class, the connection of your regular mocha stout to the aged mocha stout, like, I get it. I like where you went with that.
GREG MIGLIORE: Why don't you give us one of yours, JK.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: OK, yeah. Let me take a look at what I wrote here. OK, yeah. So I started with the Cadillac CT6.
So I currently live in Columbus, Ohio-- well, outside of Columbus, Ohio. The-- the biggest-- I don't know if it's actually the biggest, but in my mind, the biggest Columbus-based brewery is Brew Dog, which actually is a Scottish brewery. But the-- I don't know the story. I don't know how this Scottish brewery branched out into the United States and chose Columbus as their breakout market, but they did.
And now there's, like, three locations and an entire hotel that is all, like, beer-themed. Which I haven't stayed at this hotel yet, but you know, you're darn right I'm going to. Because you come in, you pick your favorite beers, and they put them on tap in your hotel room. They do beer pairings with, like, breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and all of that. Like, that's like a dream vacation for me. And my wife has agreed that we're going to go as soon as coronavirus has kind of passed. But--
GREG MIGLIORE: Oh wow, do you want to double? That sounds amazing? That is like the most awesome-- that doesn't sound like vacation. That sounds like heaven is what that sounds like.
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, right here in Columbus, Ohio. So yeah, that's-- so that's Brew Dog.
So Elvis, you know, he's, like, kind of intertwined with Cadillac, right? Like people think this pink Cadillac with the tail fins is kind of like the Elvis-mobile. So you know, I'm-- I'm taking Brew Dog Elvis Juice and equating it with the current Cadillac flagship, the CT6.
You could go Escalade. I mean, Escalade's really probably the flagship. But instead of going that route, I would take CT6. Give it the Black Wing, because that's, you know, such a cool engine that probably isn't going to be seen anywhere else.
And so the Brew Dog is a-- the Elvis Juice is a grapefruit-infused IPA. And it is absolutely delicious. That grapefruit-- you know, gives it a little bit of a pink tinge. So pink Cadillacs, Elvis juice, Cadillac CT6. That was my thinking there.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I dig it.
GREG MIGLIORE: OK, I'm going to go with a super-deep cut here. But stay with me. I think I can pull it all together. I'm going to go with a beer called the Scapa Special, which is an isle-- or a brewery-- from a brewery in the UK. The car-- or the vehicle I'm going to pick is the Land Rover Defender for obvious reasons, British car, British beer.
I had this beer on a Disney cruise once, a few years back. And the cruise stopped in Scotland. And one of the places we stopped was the-- the Orkney Islands, you know, which are kind of like right by Scapa Flow, which is famous as just a really kind of cool part of, you know, Scotland and the UK, and just that part of the world. Famous for where the German fleet was sort of captured and stored in 1917 after the armistice. The Germans surrendered and the Allies took the fleet away.
Long story short, there's a picture of a battleship on the bottle of beer. And I thought, hey, that's cool. I'll have that one. That was the thought process for selecting the beer when I was having said beer on this cruise.
And you know, it was around the time we were hearing sort of rumors of what the Defender was going to be. And it was really just a lot of, like, just, like, you know, mental association. I think I remember, at the time, googling Defenders on my phone, trying to figure out what was going to happen next, googling the different ships that were sunken in the harbor of-- at that time, sort of a side note to history is that, rather than let those ships fall into the Allied hands, the German navy scuttled them, most of them, or set them on fire. So it's really kind of, you know, a quirky footnote to World War I, which I happen to know a little bit about. Battleships are interesting to look at. I don't know, you know, why not?
And when you're looking for a beer in a foreign country, you don't really know what the right-- you know, I can tell you what the ins and outs of Michigan beers are. When I'm in Scotland, I'm not really sure which way to turn. So hey, sure, I'll take the one with the battleship on it. Land Rover--
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: I like that. I mean, I think I speak for all of those listening that we didn't know where you were going with that, Greg. But-- but you did. You kind of tied it all together-- the Land Rover Defender, the battleship.
And I think it's awesome that beer led you to increase your knowledge of-- you know, of history through googling the World War I, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So good on you for turning beer into more than just a drinking exercise.
GREG MIGLIORE: That's the Scapa Special from the Swannay Brewery. With that, I'll turn over to you, John. Give us another one.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: All right. Going with the Acura NSX. So the last pick, that was one of my favorite beers. This one is one of my favorite cars. I love the Acura NSX. I'm talking the current gen.
Anderson valley brewing company makes this gose, and they make different flavors of it. But one of them is a gin-and-tonic version, so it's got a little bit of juniper and stuff in there. Gose, you know, it's-- it's sour, it's salty, got a little bit of coriander in it. And then they add some of these other flavors that you would associate with-- with gin.
So the Acura NSX, you know, very crisp. A lot going on, though, in terms of, you know, hybrid power, internal combustion, turbo-charging. And so that's what I-- that's what it reminds me of. It reminds me of this gose-- very crisp, all these sort of different flavors coming together really, really, really well. And both are ones that you could just drive real fast for a really long time. [CHUCKLES]
GREG MIGLIORE: Boy, I'm sold. You literally-- it's gin-and-tonic weather, I would say. You know, you want a light drink, maybe on the patio, after-- you know, after work. You're reading or, you know, refereeing the kids, whatever you're doing. A gin and tonic, this time of year, I think, is quite refreshing. Let's put it that way.
I have some Griffin Claw gin. Definitely, I think, gonna have one of those tonight.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: It's always time. You know, you guys don't know Greg like we do. But it's always trying for Greg to have a gin and tonic. He's a-- definitely a connoisseur.
GREG MIGLIORE: I used to be more into it than I was, to be perfectly honest. I-- I just kind of got into different things, like wines. And you know, I don't know. Then my son was born, and he got up very early so I kind of wasn't drinking for a while. But yeah, gin and tonic, tried and true.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: OK, I guess it's my turn for the next beer.
GREG MIGLIORE: Sure.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: And I'm going to set you up with this one, Greg.
GREG MIGLIORE: OK.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: So you know, you guys can't see our list. But I'm jumping in our list of things that we were going to talk about.
GREG MIGLIORE: I tell you what, how about we just do this again. So, like, if you need to save a few, bank a few, it's all good.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, I had one for the Jeep Wrangler and the Dodge Hellcat Redeye series. But I'm going-- I'm going to the next one on my list, because I think it's going to play into Greg's-- Greg's potential choices.
I'm going with the entire Buick lineup.
GREG MIGLIORE: OK, bold play.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES]
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, the entire Buick lineup. And I am equating it to a beer that most of our listeners, unless they live here in Ohio, where I do, they probably do not know this brewery. But I'm going with Wild Ohio Brewing, specifically their DalyPalmer lemonade flavor tea beer.
You guys can't see it. I'm-- I'm holding a can up right now that the rest of our staff can see that are watching this, Greg and John. But yeah, it's a-- it's exactly what it sounds like, lemonade flavored tea beer. Everyone knows the Arnold Palmer at the half tea, half lemonade. And that's basically what this is, except it's like throw in the beer side of things as well.
So first of all, it's gluten free. So if that matters to anyone out there-- it doesn't matter to me. I take all the gluten I can get. But for those who are specifically looking for gluten free, this is. It's a tea beer, so it's not made with traditional barley, rice, that kind of thing. It's got green tea, black tea, and monk fruit extract, along with citric acid to make it, you know, citricky-- citrusy and lemonadey. And it's absolutely delicious.
And the reason I equate it with the Buick lineup, Arnold Palmer wasn't just a famous golfer, wasn't just a heavy consumer of tea-and-lemonade drinks. He also was a car guy. And he owned several dealerships when he was alive, including Cadillac dealerships and also Buick dealerships.
I don't know about you guys, but I think of Buicks as the choice for, you know, the kind of people who are likely to go pick up, you know, 18 rounds here and there, throw their clubs in the back, whether it's their crossovers or their Regal wagons. I don't know, they-- like, Buick golfing works for me in my head. Arnold Palmer was a Buick dealership owner. So yeah, I'm going the Buick lineup and the Wild Ohio Brewing DalyPalmer tea lemonade beer.
GREG MIGLIORE: When I--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I dig it.
GREG MIGLIORE: When I think of Buick, the only thing I can think of is German sports sedans blasting around the Nordschleife. I-- I don't think of golf at all. I don't know what you're talking about. I-- I say that--
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Oh, come on.
GREG MIGLIORE: --tongue firmly in cheek right there.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Buick and golfing-- OK, and here's-- here's the handoff to Greg. Do you know where Arnold Palmer was from?
GREG MIGLIORE: Columbus, Ohio? Or was that Jack Nicklaus?
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: No. No, no. That's not Arnold Palmer. Arnold Palmer was from Latrobe, Pennsylvania. Latrobe, Pennsylvania, home of Rolling Rock.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Rolling Rock.
GREG MIGLIORE: Oh, that's such a great tee-up. All right, so I'm going to-- I threw a bunch of other ones on there. And-- but I'm definitely going to go to that one next now. But yeah, I agree with you. When I think of Buick, I think of golf. I think when golf really took off in, like, you know, really widespread popularity-- a couple times, in the '60s, and then in the '90s, you know, when Tiger Woods really made the sport, like, must-see TV, if you will-- you know, Buicks were great cars of the '60s. By the '90s, they were kind of, you know, sort of on the downside a little bit. But yeah, yeah, I'd agree with that theory.
And then Rolling Rock. This is not quite as off-the-wall as my battleship comparison. But Jaguar is based in New Jersey as far as their sort of like US sales operation. It's where like, you know, when editors, salespeople, if you will, just basically anybody in North America outside of, say, consumer, needs to deal with Jaguar or Land Rover, you talk to somebody in a suit in-- in New Jersey.
So my thought is, OK, let's tie this together. And this is-- stay with me here. When my dad was in the service in the early '60s, he drank Rolling Rocks. He was stationed at Fort Monmouth, New Jersey, which I believe is now closed. Old fort that I'm sure has been closed for decades. I drank Rolling Rock when I was a-- a youngster, if you will, in college. It's a rather light beer, so it's easy to drink when you're maybe just adjusting your palate.
It's still, frankly, a good beer, I think, to drink when it's about 110 degrees. I have no issues with it. It was actually, when I was at Michigan State, chicken wings were $0.10 and Rolling Rocks were $1.00. So you could have, on Wednesday nights, at this one bar on campus, you could have a pretty good night for about $10.
All this is-- all of this is to say it's a pretty light beer. What's lightweight? We've already established that Jaguar/Land Rover is in New Jersey. How about the Jaguar F Type SVR, which cuts off plenty of weight over the-- you know, the standard F Type models, just using some "back of the napkin" calculations. The wheels save you 30 pounds. The carbon ceramic braking system-- and now I'm getting it straight from Jaguar.com, JaguarUSA.com-- saves 46 pounds of [? unsprung ?] weight.
So yeah, I mean, if you want a lighter beer to pair it up with a lighter car, sure, that's-- that's my comparison. I know some of my friends in Jaguar PR are probably like, dude, you're comparing us to, like, this Rolling Rock beer based on this random family anecdote? But sure.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: No, I think that's-- I think that's great. Like, this is my new favorite podcast segment. And-- and also, like, there's absolutely nothing wrong with an inexpensive light beer.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Absolutely nothing wrong at all.
GREG MIGLIORE: Technically Rolling Rock's not a light beer, per se. There isn't Rolling Rock Light. But it's definitely lighter compared to, like, you know, bourbon barrel, you know, kerosene-infused, you know, "light it on fire" stouts.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, totally. And-- and, like, you know, Rolling Rock as a cheap beer-- you always have to have some cheap beer in your fridge. You have to. Like those days that you're out doing yard work. You know, you just finished mowing the grass, and you're hot and sweaty, and you walk in, open up your refrigerator. What do you want? You don't want the burble-- bourbon-barrel-aged stout. You want the light American lager or pilsner, whatever it is. Rolling Rock fits the bill. I'm all for it, Greg. Love it.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right, so I think we're getting a little tight on time here. We may be getting a bit indulgent here. Hopefully our readers are still with us-- or listeners are still with us. Let's each do one quick one, just like, you know, real quick explanation. We'll do a round robin. And then we'll spend some money-- on cars, not booze. Start with you, John.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES] I did the Mazda Miata. It's Blackrocks Brewing 51K IPA. Very, you know, very good. Very crisp, but, you know, hits you in the face with a lot of flavor. There's a lot-- there's a lot to take in, and a lot of-- you know, it's-- it's sort of a heady beer, and-- and the Miata's sort of a heady car. There's not too much to it. Like, this is and IPA that comes in a can. Mazda Miata's not-- you know, it's a good replacement for some of the-- you know, the whale of IPAs out there that you want to find. So there you go.
GREG MIGLIORE: Jeremy.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yes, sir. I'm going to go to Jeep Wrangler. Jeep, Americana, classic red, white, and blue, Wrangler. This time of year, I'm thinking-- you know, it's summer. People take the top off. They go cruising in their Wranglers. You know, if this was winter, I could make the case for something else, but it's summer. So Wrangler, classic Americana. What's the big, classic American craft brewery? Sam Adams. Jeep Wrangler, summer, beach, et cetera, et cetera. While-- while Sam Adams makes a delicious summer ale. It's a citrusy wheat beer infused with, like, a-- a lemon zest, that kind of thing.
So yeah, I equate Jeep Wrangler with Sam Adams Summer Ale.
GREG MIGLIORE: Very nice. I like the summer ale. It's a good golfing beer too. Pretty tasty. I had one--
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Going back-- going back to Buick, are we?
GREG MIGLIORE: Well, actually I'll tie that together with Ford. I was actually golfing with some people I know from Ford a couple of years ago. And I had a Sam Adams Summer Ale. And there were extra beers left over, so I brought a few home.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Nice.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah, it was at the local place-- local golf club. So it was cool.
All right, I'll be quick here. Aviator Gin-- John got me on the gin and tonics. So I'm going to say Aviator Gin, which is pretty solid. Can't beat that. And I'm going to take a Spyker, which if you're thinking of cars, you're like, that's a pretty deep one. But yeah, I'll go with-- I'll go with Spyker, the C8 Aileron, which is one of their more recent supercars.
Spyker has a long history in aviation. They originally made biplanes 106 years ago. Also, for the First World War, their logo, their crest, is a propeller, which-- good trivia-- is also BMW's emblem as well. But the Bimmer logo spins faster so it looks more like a circle, whereas this is a straight-up propeller. Gin and tonic. I'll leave it there.
Let's do this again sometime, guys.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah. Heck yeah.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right, so let's spend some money. All right, just roll on down here to the Spend My Money segment. Here we go.
All right, another longtime listener. So thanks for listening. So here's the history, and then I'll get to the question. "As a teenager, I had an interesting array of cars. I had a 1969 280 SL." That's awesome. I drove a '62 SL, which is a little bit older, a little bit of a different car. His father still has the car. He might get to inherit it. That's pretty awesome. Got to drive this around in his late teens/early 20s. That's a great way to spend your late teens and your early 20s.
Also had a 1985 Chevy station wagon. Learned to drive on a standard-- great use of the-- the language there. 1976 240D Mercedes. Had a few Buicks and Oldsmobile while growing up. So that ticks a couple of boxes here for both of my co-hosts. First car he drove was a '99 Honda Civic SI back in Canada, which is kind of interesting. We'll bring [? Riswick ?] in, maybe, at some point, if we need to. He's Canadian for those of you that don't know.
Yeah, then he had a 2005 Mazda 3, all new, with a manual. Right now-- oh, and then the context there is had to shift to minivans. Hey, that's OK. Don't be sad about that. He wrote "sadly," but I think a lot of minivans are great.
Right now, they have a 2015 Outback owned and a 2018 Pacifica leased. We had a long-term Pacifica that was pretty good. It was probably the equivalent of having a leased Pacifica. He also rides a 2014 Ninja 1000 in the winter. Planning to give the Outback to one of his daughters and buy himself a car.
Here's the short list. Kia Stinger with the V6, Genesis G70-- again, with a bigger engine-- the Golf R. OK, couple other options he might look at-- Honda Accord, Mazda 6, Hyundai Sonata. The criteria is, must be fun to drive, must have four doors, back seats must be usable. So the Civic is going to be too small. Must be new. They're going to lease. And again, looking for a sedan or better, i.e. wagon-slash-hatch. No SUVs. Comfortable interior.
Two categories-- boy, he really lays this out. I love it when, like, Spend My Money writers sort of, like, you know, already analyzed-- they pre-analyzed their question. One's below 40 grand, one's above-- above that, obviously, but still within the window of under 50 grand. This is from Andrew. What do we think, guys?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: OK. I-- so he said Kia Stinger and Genesis G70. You know, same platform. The Stinger's a little bigger. I like the G70 better as a driver. The Kia Stinger is super fun. The G70's got a little more, like, crispness to it.
That said, the G70 back seat is pretty tight. So I'm going with the Kia Stinger. On the high end, I'm really digging the-- the Mazda 6-- the turbocharged Mazda 6 with the signature trim level, it just feels really, really nice. The suspension is excellent. It's really dialed in. The way it corners is-- it's surprising. But that's-- that'd be the car I'd pick in that tier of vehicles. So Stinger and Mazda 6.
GREG MIGLIORE: Very cool. John-- excuse me, Jeremy, what do you think?
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Yeah, you know what, I usually like to come to these things armed with something that you wouldn't expect. This time, I looked at the-- at Andrew's list, and I-- I pinpointed straight to the Stinger. You know, I hate to be a broken record, but-- so Andrew mentioned, as you said, Greg, he had broken something-- broken his choices out to under $40,000 and under $50,000.
Either way, I'd go Stinger. You can get a Stinger for less than $40,000 with the 2-liter. He-- he specifically mentioned the-- the turbo V6. But don't discount the 4-cylinder Stinger, especially when you're comparing it with vehicles in your own-- in your list of the Honda Accord, Mazda 6, and Sonata.
The-- the Stinger, with its 4-cylinder rear-wheel drive platform, is still, dynamically, a very cool, fun car. So if you weren't-- if you're thinking of the stinger as one of the higher-end examples with the 6-cylinder, also consider it as one of your more mainstream examples with the 4-cylinder.
But either way, I'm sticking with the Stinger. I think it suits your criteria. You seem like the kind of guy who likes something a little bit different that you're not going to see coming and going all the time. Stinger will give you that. It'll give you rear-wheel drive driving dynamics that I think will appeal to you. And you prefer wagons, hatches. The Stinger meet your-- your hatchback criteria.
So you know, I just think that-- that of what you're looking for, Andrew, a Stinger meets your-- your criteria the best. And I think you'd have fun with it. So that's where I'm going.
GREG MIGLIORE: It's a tough-- it's a tough field. And it's actually kind of fun to actually talk about sedans. The Golf R was actually on there, too. It's an intriguing option, although I think you're going to have a lot of compromises with that back seat, which Andrew mentions is a problem.
I think the Accord is absolutely a gorgeous car, especially in the top trim with the 2.0-- 2-liter turbo. Mazda 6 will drive a little bit better. And they're about the same in the looks department. Really good-looking cars.
So that's the two I would kind of look at as far as really getting a great value. The G70 and the Stinger, I vacillate. I go back and forth between which one I like better. We had a long-term Stinger, and it was amazing to drive. I thought it was so much fun. But the Genesis is really good too. In fact, I feel like the last time I-- I actually got into the G70, I was like, oh, I think I like this better than the Kia.
You know, so for me it's-- I'm not as, like, entrenched with either one of those. But they're worth looking at, worth driving. I would humbly suggest the Dodge Charger. If you're looking for a rear-wheel drive sedan, what's not to like? You know, that's, like, one of the original "red meat and potatoes," like, cars that are on the market. So that's-- that's another good one to consider, I think. Yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Scat Pack.
GREG MIGLIORE: Scat Pack, yeah.
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Charger Scat Pack, right? I mean, you get the-- the big, naturally-aspirated Hemi V8, which is stupid powerful. And it fits right into your-- into your budget-- budgetary concerns as well.
GREG MIGLIORE: Yeah. But as far as I'm looking at this list, just from the list here, I would play it safe and go with the Accord. I just-- I really like how it looks. That wouldn't have been my pick even a few years ago, just because I think the record was pretty-- pretty plain, pretty boring. But I just-- for me, It really does come to looks. I think it's a gorgeous car. And that's where I would probably land. You know, unless you want to, again, jump out and see how a Charger fits your-- fits your needs, if you will.
All right, so we will leave it there. Pretty long podcast this week. But hey, listen to it in chunks, maybe while you're having a beer on the patio, walking your dog, or whatever it is you need to do this weekend.
Guys, it's been fun. Any final thoughts?
JEREMY KORZENIEWSKI: Beer.
GREG MIGLIORE: OK.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: [CHUCKLES] Yeah, I'm thirsty now.
GREG MIGLIORE: All right, we're recording this on a Thursday. It's getting late in the day. Thursday, I think, is a great happy hour evening. So we will leave it there. Be safe out there. All right, we'll see you next time.
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