Remember when Fisker Automotive denied that the Surf – the wagon version of the Karma – was delayed? Yeah, you can forget that, apparently.

A reader named Dennis posted this to the Fisker Buzz forums – "I was told that Fisker is willing to build Surfs one-off for anyone willing to pay $200K" – and we thought that was interesting enough to ask for an official response. Guess what? It's kind of true. Roger Ormisher, Fisker's senior director of global corporate communications and PR, told AutoblogGreen that:

The Surf is currently on the back burner as we finalize our plans to bring Atlantic to market. That is the number one focus here at Fisker as the volume of that model is key to our long-term success.
There is no official plan to build the Surf at this stage as an assembly plant volume variant, so the only option available is as a modified, bespoke or custom build Karma. If someone came along with a big enough checkbook, we are always open to discussions
.

Our friends at Green Car Reports found out that the Surf and the Sunset models are taking a back seat to the Atlantic. And we're sure that dealing with the latest recall tops the To Do list. Still, who's interested in getting their own special one-off Fisker?


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    • 1 Second Ago
  • 33 Comments
      PR
      • 2 Years Ago
      Bluepongo The Roadster glider is absolutely BASED upon the Lotus as I said. And the Roadster gliders absolutely are built by Lotus in their factory. I'm a huge Tesla fanboy, to the point that I've been accused of working for Tesla by folks here on ABG, so I don't know what your argument is, because Tesla's unique patents and body part changes don't contradict what I said at all. Both are true, and are not mutually exclusive. Tesla absolutely did need help from other companies. First they went to AC Propulsion to license the electric drivetrain out of AC Propulsion's tzero. Then they went to Lotus and hired them to build their glider. The fact that Tesla added their own IP and design changes does not change the fact that Tesla absolutely got help from other companies. Here is what Elon Musk said about the gov't loans for the Model S before he took them. Elon Musk "delayed the car’s debut to mid-2011 and is waiting on a low-interest Department of Energy loan due in six to eight months. That will cover about three-quarters of the cost of the Model S. Tesla will try to raise another $50 million or so after the loan comes through. By then, Mr. Musk said, he hopes that the markets will have stabilized and potential investors will see Tesla as a less risky investment because of the government loan. He also hopes to get some of the federal government’s $25 billion bailout package for the auto industry, 10 percent of which is reserved for small car companies. " This is from an October 2008 interview with Elon Musk himself: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/10/24/musk-unplugged-tesla-ceo-discusses-car-troubles/
      bluepongo1
      • 2 Years Ago
      My reply won't show up for PR so here goes: First off my sincere thanks for your post but TESLA was in production for two years before Elon, Lotus, Fisker and the government were involved. You probably weren't aware of the Roadster variants for the focus group R,G, and B. If you ever meet someone with a variant ask them who gave it to them. If you meet Elon, Brad Pitt, or George Clooney you can ask them who asked them : What color would you like on your (year 3) TESLA (black,blue, and black respectively) that would be ME. I guess when TESLA goes private next year all this heresay for slow newsdays will go away.
        Marcopolo
        • 2 Years Ago
        @bluepongo1
        @ bluepongo1 Well done, you are definitely the winner of this month's, ' Weird Post' contest !
        PR
        • 2 Years Ago
        @bluepongo1
        Bluepongo, Ah, you are a Martin Eberhart fetishist. I get it. The early pre-Musk work was still based upon AC Propulsion's licenses, so they were still dependent upon upon other companies even dating back to the very beginning. It is a pretty large leap to call that early work "production". Those were still way before anything that could be called production. Those weren't even pre-production, they were concepts. You imply early involvement in some way, so I'll respect your viewpoints on what the company was like before Elon stepped in. But Elon certainly did step in, and for better or worse Tesla and the Roadster definitely changed. When the rest of us talk about the Tesla Roadster, we all talk about the actual real one that went into full general-availability production. Everything I said applies to THAT Tesla Roadster. What was true before then is fun historic play. But it is silly to imply that my posts must take into account stuff that what was once fact nearly a decade ago, but has since that time changed and is no longer fact. I'm not going to put in every post about Tesla that my comments only apply to the actual Tesla Roadster that finally went into production and was sold to customers. I'm not going to put in every post that my comments do not apply to the earliest Roadster variants before the Lotus was involved. I'm not going to put in very post that my comments do not apply to Tesla's work before Elon came on board. But you should read that into every post I make about Tesla as being implicitly implied.
        Grendal
        • 2 Years Ago
        @bluepongo1
        Huh? This post confused me. Tesla is going private after going public? Can you please clarify the points you're trying to make here. Thanks.
          bluepongo1
          • 2 Years Ago
          @Grendal
          The R has a lighter sport suspension, the G has more luxury options; the year3 "full" production is based on the B variant. The public offering was tied to the government loan pressure; it will be reversed as soon as possible. PR so hundreds of cars isn't production? It sure seemed like it to me. Thanks to all for your intrest !
      korblalak
      • 2 Years Ago
      Can't help but wonder if the surf aims to catch waves or fire?
      Letstakeawalk
      • 2 Years Ago
      Burying the lede... "...as we finalize our plans to bring Atlantic to market. That is the number one focus here at Fisker..." Raising the $150 million they've previously said was the amount needed ought not be too difficult. Can't wait to here an official production plan from Fisker regarding the Atlantic.
        Letstakeawalk
        • 2 Years Ago
        @Letstakeawalk
        And for that matter, a Sunset at only $200k seems right on target for that market!
      Jon Acton
      • 2 Years Ago
      If Fisker actually got it the Atlantic would have been first. By this time next year they will be bankrupt. I'd love an electric car, just not a Fisker. He's nothing more than a big talking schiester without a clue. Just listen to him during an interview.
        PR
        • 2 Years Ago
        @Jon Acton
        Jon, That's just silly talk. The Karma allowed Fisker to prove that it was possible to put the REEV drivetrain into a real car that people could really buy, but without having to build their own factory. They had Valmet actually use their small-batch production facility to build it, similar to how Tesla got gliders from Lotus. You have to remember that when Fisker started all this stuff back in the mid-2000's, there were absolutely zero highway capable mass produced EV's or PHEV/REEV's. The most common word in EV car blogs was "vaporware". Putting together a high-dollar model using somebody else's manufacturing facilities was exactly the right choice, just like building the Tesla Roadster based upon a Lotus body was exactly the right choice. Opening a factory and starting with a mass production model as the first car isn't realistic at all. So while it is time to move on to the Atlantic, Fisker made the right choice at the time. Fisker has successfully built small batch cars from his own company (the original Fisker Automotive) so saying he is a "big talking schiester" is provably wrong. He is a serious business man who is seriously trying to make his company work.
      bluepongo1
      • 2 Years Ago
      If you did some research instead of repeat internet heresay you would know that the Roadster shares no parts with any Lotus. That was a rumor started by Fisker and Lotus to undermine TESLA and promote their failing brands. Look up all the unique patents that TESLA owns pretaining to TESLA products; they never needed anything from other companies or the government. To answer again why TESLA took gov. money: they were pressured by the gov. like the mafia to take the money to be in their sphere of influence.
      Letstakeawalk
      • 2 Years Ago
      I'm sure that nobody here is interested...but the Fisker Surf is currently on display at Fisker Silicon Valley. http://fiskerbuzz.com/forums/Thread-Fisker-Surf-at-Fisker-Silicon-Valley
      Rick
      • 2 Years Ago
      200k l would rather buy a nice second hand Ford GT if l had that sort of money to burn on cars. What boring looking station wagon, it catches fire as well.
        EZEE
        • 2 Years Ago
        @Rick
        Wow, have they appreciated up to $200k?
      Nick
      • 2 Years Ago
      I don't quite get the Surf concept, but the Sunset is handsome.
      Marco Polo
      • 2 Years Ago
      Fisker has succeeded with the Karma, because the Karma appeals to an affluent market who care more about style than function. It's a forgiving market which understands that the Karma is a sensational looking vehicle, with unique technology from a new company, headed by a famous designer. This allows Fisker a period of grace to concentrate on correcting the Karma's problems and defects. In the era of massive incentives, very cheap taxpayer funded loans, and a large factory going free, it made some sense to commence US manufacture, rather than outsourcing. Risky, but not without some logic. The Atlantic is designed to be a volume seller, competing in a far less forgiving market. Unlike the Karma, the Atlantic will compete for sales against the superior GM Volt, rapidly improving Japanese hybrids and European developments. In this market, the Atlantic's styling will be less important and issues such as technical superiority, quality control, finish, reliability, cheap leasing and service networks, will be more important to consumers and fleet owners. This is the strength of the big OEM's. Why try to go head to head with far more powerful competitors? Fisker should concentrate on capturing it's own market segment first before attempting to enter the highly competitive mass market. Fisker Motors doesn't have the capital or resources. It takes years (or a lot of money) to establish all the infrastructure needed to become a mass manufacturer of Auto-mobiles. Tesla has a lot more money, and a very unconventional approach to auto-manufacture and marketing. There is no certainty that Tesla will succeed. With the Atlantic, Fisker is attempting a conventional approach, requiring enormous capital and resources (which it doesn't have) and a product that's just not unique enough for the mass market. As a small Luxury marque, with sensational styling and a specialized drive-train, Fisker Motors can sell vehicles with a high enough profit margin to justify it existence. It would be better to produce 5000 Sunsets per year at $ 50,000 profit each, than attempt to sell 50-70,000 Atlantic's per year at a loss ! Fisker needs to concentrate on establishing the reputation of the Karma first, and then seek to JV with an OEM to produce a mass production car. As an example, The Atlantic if sold as a 'Fisker by Ford', would be able to compete very successfully and enhance the reputation of both companies.
        PR
        • 2 Years Ago
        @Marco Polo
        The Atlantic doesn't compete in the same market sector as the Volt anymore than the Model S competes with the Leaf. The Volt is a 9 second front wheel drive car. The Atlantic is supposed to be nearly twice as fast, and rear-wheel drive. The closest GM has to compete is the $58K Cadillac ELR, and it still doesn't compete on drivetrain configuration or performance: http://green.autoblog.com/2012/08/17/cadillac-will-debut-production-elr-at-next-years-pebble-beach-c/ Having Valmet small-batch build Karma's, Sunsets, etc in Europe and importing them to the US is not a long-term business plan. Neither is building an entire US factory just to do 5,000 units a year. This small a production also will never drive down per-unit costs the amount that will be needed to be competitive in the future. Trying such a business plan would only assure that Fisker never becomes a mass-market player, and would allow other players to dwarf them and drive them out. The only way to drive down per-unit costs is through mass production. And the only way to grab and hold the "Prius" market leadership position for a high performance RWD luxury REEV is to launch ASAP and grab that market sector and own it. Then use mass production to drive down costs in order to protect their market lead.
          EZEE
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          Don't think I have ever accused anyone of working for anybody....
          EZEE
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          @PR Remember early on,mi said something nice about Ford Motor, and I was accused of working for them. Ironically I actually have two Fords, but out of circumstance. The Fusion is my company car, I had no choice. My Beloved Ranger was a bit of a rush buy due to the company I worked for wouldn't allow us to tow with out company cars any more, so I turned in the Taurus they gave me, and bought the Ranger. Be that as it may, people can't argue any more. Thisis why I tell people to read Alinsky. People have been taught that ad hominem attacks count as an argument. This is why, instead of talking about deficits, healthcare, or taxation, we hear about dogs on roofs (Romney), eating dogs (Obama), blacks in chain (Biden), and Is our children learning (Classic Bush). The only thing I have against you and Marco fighting is, I usually need to get out books to understand the creative insults. @ltaw :D
          Marcopolo
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          @ PR, Well, evidently civility and reason still don't work with you. (same old obnoxious PR). However, at least this time you left out the racial insults! But you must have delusions of grandeur, no one imagined you worked for the auto-mobile industry, except at a retail dealer level, as a salesman or or possibly an F&I clerk. Even then, this was only a polite inquiry following a post in which you advocated purchasing from two car dealers, in a manner that read like an advertizement !
          PR
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          Poor unhinged Marco. Doesn't even understand the concept of race.
          PR
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          LTW I literally laughed out loud! Good one! EZEE -- Maybe you just haven't gotten to be close enough of a buddy to Marco Polo / marcopolo / marco polo to join in, unlike some others? That's not a bad thing.
          Marcopolo
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          @PR, Given your inability to discuss rather than rant, I will try once again to reason with you, civilly. The Atlantic model is designed to compete in a market segment. It's a 4 door, EREV. Fisker has indicated that it hopes to sell the base version for $40,000 rising to 51,000 for it's top model. This is a market segment occupied by vehicles usually priced between $ 38,000 and 58,000. The Atlantic is a relatively small car, (especially interior/ luggage). Nor will it ever have particularly spectacular performance. It's nearest comparison is the Volt (well actually, the only comparative vehicle currently produced). If GM produced a Buick version of the Volt based on the Ampera, that would be a more direct comparison. In fact, the Atlantic will occupy a very small market niche. Far too small to sustain the profitable production of a vehicle requiring 70,000 vehicles p.a.minimum. The idea that mass-production can drive down unit costs, relies on the ability to sell high volumes of units ! For Fisker Motors, this would be an impossible task with a high priced vehicle. The market just isn't that big. It took years for Prius, backed by Toyota's incredibly deep pockets, and vast resources to establish the Prius brand. A '"High performance luxury REEV,", launched by an inexperienced and under-capitalized manufacturer of already dubious reputation, (and no other income), is doomed to failure ! The Karma is a totally different proposition. An extra 10% to the price of the Sunset, won't stop the buyers, a few minor glitches, wont stop the buyers. But no such forgiveness will be extended to the Atlantic. In the case of the Atlantic, Peter Scott would be quite right to expect BMW or Lexus quality. Oh, and finally, just how big do you think the market sector for a "high performance RWD luxury REEV " is ? Building a factory, to produce such a vehicle would be financial suicide ! Small scale production of top end specialized luxury GT sports sedans and convertibles, doesn't require a large factory to be built to "drive down per-unit costs", since price is not a consideration ! Fisker should leave the volume market to those equipped to cater to such a market, and concentrate on getting it's first product established.
          Letstakeawalk
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          Don't look at me, I work for the Hydrogen lobby, and only support Fisker as a way to subvert true BEVs.
          EZEE
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          Please, kids, stop fighting. Maybe Marco right about America being the land of opportunity, and maybe PR's got a point about the machinery of capitalism being oiled with the blood of the workers.
          PR
          • 2 Years Ago
          @PR
          Marco Given your lack of ability to be intellectually honest, I have no desire to debate with you. I've had my say. Given that Fisker agrees with my conclusion, and is proceeding exactly as I've explained, you can believe whatever you want. You can choose to understand what is actually happening in real life, or continue to reject it. That is your choice. Meanwhile Fisker will continue on with the Atlantic exactly as stated in this article. Given all the repeated accusations that you and your buddies have made that I must work in the automotive industry for all the top EV/REEV builders, like Chevy, Toyota, Tesla, even Fisker, you would think you might actually listen when one of those companies actually does exactly what I say they should be doing....
        SVX pearlie
        • 2 Years Ago
        @Marco Polo
        Apparently, from the other Fisker story, the Karma appeals to people with more money than brains. It's for when buying a $100k Porsche or Corvette makes no sense, because it's too damn reliable.
      PR
      • 2 Years Ago
      "as we finalize our plans to bring Atlantic to market. That is the number one focus here at Fisker as the volume of that model is key to our long-term success." Thank God that Fisker actually gets it. The Surf, the Sunset, and even the Karma are not the key to Fisker's success. The Atlantic is the big dog on which everything hinges. Figuring out the cause of the Karma fires is a To-Done. Tying up the details will mostly be in the hands of the parts suppliers and the dealership's mechanics, not Fisker HQ. Fisker needs to re-start their Atlantic press blitz more like Tesla did with their Model S. They need validation vehicles making rounds being displayed at stores. They need select folks getting ride-alongs with videos to be leaked to youtube. They need video of cold-weather and hot-weather testing. Heck, pull what Audi did with the e-tron and send it around the n-ring (not gonna try to spell it...)
        SVX pearlie
        • 2 Years Ago
        @PR
        They should pull a page from the Volt playbook, and have extended independent shakedown with people who know EREVs before selling any. Except that kind of testing costs a lot of money because it delays the launch. And apparently, Fisker buyers don't care about polish or reliability..
        Spec
        • 2 Years Ago
        @PR
        "Figuring out the cause of the Karma fires is a To-Done." I think it is a "Well Done". ;-)
      PR
      • 2 Years Ago
      OMG EZEE! According to Marco's standards, you are a racist who just made racist comments. Next thing you know, he's going to be using the exact same attack on you that he is using on me.
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