The crew at Translogic took the time to stop by and see the the team at ALTe Powertrain Technologies. Founded by a group of former Tesla Motors executives, the company focuses on building plug-in hybrid conversions for fleet vehicles. From creations like a Ford F-150 with a 2.0-liter gasoline engine and two 60 kW electric motors to full-size delivery trucks, buses and vans, the company is focused on reducing fuel consumption on some of the largest and hardest-working machinery out there. ALTe says the F-150 conversion supplies up to 465 pound-feet of torque, which is more than the old 4.6-liter V8.

Most of the truck conversions come with 22 kWh lithium-ion battery packs, yielding 25-40 miles of all-electric range. From there, the four-cylinder kicks in to keep the batteries charged and the motors spinning.

ALTe says the company has focused on Ford conversions first, since the F-Series is the best-selling pickup in the country. While E-Series and Panther-based creations are also on the docket, ALTe is also focusing on partnering with OEMs in China. Scroll down below to check out the video for yourself.


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  • 59 Comments
      SVX pearlie
      • 3 Years Ago
      Satellite Auto Glass is *already* running Chevy Volts around SoCal wearing their corporate livery. And that's a "strong" 35-40 mile EREV, not a 5-10 mile PHEV which requires the engine to reach and maintain highway speeds...
        SVX pearlie
        • 3 Years Ago
        @SVX pearlie
        Sorry, "Safelite", not "satellite" (auto-correct) 18 Chevy Volts on commerical lease, averaging 55+ mpg and covering 2000+ miles per month. http://www.automotive-fleet.com/Channel/Leasing/Article/Story/2012/03/Safelite-Autoglass-Pilots-the-Chevrolet-Volt.aspx
      Letstakeawalk
      • 3 Years Ago
      Here's Quantum's F-150 conversion, also shown at that show: http://www.qtww.com/assets/u/F150PHEVTruck.pdf
        Joeviocoe
        • 7 Months Ago
        @Letstakeawalk
        Ah, very similar. How much for a conversion though?
      Rick
      • 3 Years Ago
      Should bring it to the UK it would sell like hotcakes. Gotta say l would buy one.
      dmay
      • 3 Years Ago
      These kinds of fleet conversions make EVs incredibly profitable for the buyer. Think about this, the US tax code allows companies to deduct about $.50 a mile for driving. Now, for a consulting company, that $.50 per mile is not really a deduction, it's passed on to the client as a reimbursable. The company gets that $.50 back regardless of their profits that year. Let's say there's a consulting company that drives a F-150 10,000 miles per year. An F-150 typically gets about 15 miles per gallon, so the company could expect to spend nearly $.30/mile on gas, netting the company $.20/mile in reimbursable expenses or about $4600/year (not accounting for depreciation, etc.). Now, let's say the conversion company is able to triple the F-150's efficiency by going PHEV. The truck now averages just 45 mpge. So, for 20,000 miles the company nets $8200. This means that the company MAKES (not saves) $3600 per year just driving the truck 20,000 miles. Multiply that by, say, 8 years and driving the truck 160,000 miles will make the consulting company nearly $30,000. If the price of gas averages at $5/gal over the 8 years the EV would make the company $35000 -tax free. *This, of course doesn't take into account vehicle depreciation and assumes that the per kilowatt-hour price of electricity is the same a gasoline.
        Joeviocoe
        • 7 Months Ago
        @dmay
        Well, this is a seperate argument from driving on electricity. This is just about driving more miles to make more money. The savings from switching drivetrains remains the same and is independent from any tax credit. Tax breaks are a whole other animal. One could argue that the company SAVES the taxes they would have paid... and does not MAKE profit really since they can only receive up to the amount they would have paid in taxes.
      Ryan
      • 3 Years Ago
      This company needs to work with the truck factories to get the trucks without the engine in them. If all they are doing is just ripping the engine out and putting a new one + EV motor back in.
      Marco Polo
      • 3 Years Ago
      Converting existing vehicles to Plug In Hybrids, is pretty uneconomic. Not only does the technology present problems, but the conversions can't be justified economically. As a business model, it has one distinct disadvantage, if the conversions were successful, the glider OEM would simply offer it's production version, effectively destroying the conversion market. These guys would be better off converting buses to EREV, with ICE engines running on Propane (LPG) or Bio-diesel. The difference in economics between buying a new bus, or a conversion with the political sales advantage of a very low emissions vehicle, makes a far more appealing sales story.
        2 Wheeled Menace
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Marco Polo
        Driving a car can't be justified economically, not when you can get a really nice cargo bike ( Yuba Mundo ) for around $1100, put a motor kit on it ( $1,000 ), haul 2 adults, or 1 adult and 2-3 kids.. Does a $100,000 Fisker Karma pay off? Does a $10,000 Nissan Versa pay off? if you look at economics, the car is always the worst choice possible.
          Joeviocoe
          • 7 Months Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          That is a poor argument. Cars DO PAY OFF, if you have a job that is outside biking distance, wish to get to work even when very hot or cold outside, can't afford to live very close to every place you go to.. There are good arguments for living in a city, where car ownership is truly optional. But for the rest of the country (suburbs and rural) a car is a necessity. If a $100,000 car gets you to your hedge fund office where you make $150,000 a year... it STILL PAYS OFF. It is not "the worse possible choice" ... just a choice. Here are more absurdisms: Does a house pay off? No, you could live in a box. Does your computer pay off? No, you go to the library.
          Marco Polo
          • 7 Months Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          @ 2WM' Now you've really lost the plot ! In very few cities can a bicycle be ridden safely with one person let alone 4 ! Such a contraption (motorised nor not) is probably possible,but if operated on the highway, I should think it would constitute child abuse ! Lot's of people, for one reason or another can't ride a bike, also I don't think a bike, cargo or not, could haul 2200 lbs, for any distance ! So, I think the F 100 series is safe from competition from bikes for quite a while !
        dmay
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Marco Polo
        I don't know, I kind of think that such a conversion makes more sense on larger vehicles, like the ones presented in the video, because there is simply more room in the frame for the additional equipment. A Honda Fit is already incredibly tight, where every single piece is custom designed in 3D CAD space for optimum space and efficiency. An F-350 doesn't have the same space problems. There is plenty of room under the hood and under the bed for additional equipment.
      • 3 Years Ago
      There seems to be a rush to judgment here boys. Light a candle – don’t curse the darkness. This is not sexy stuff like Fisker and Tesla, but it is necessary stuff. I have seen these guys at fleet trade shows and the economics do work for the poor guys in the fleet industry with few choices for alternative fuel/propulsion systems. You can’t cite EPA window stickers fuel economy when using a real economic model called total cost of ownership. EPA numbers do not represent real like experience for fleets. You have to use real “rubber hits the road” metrics like “how much gas did I consume this week with my Ford V8 in the field vs. how much did ALTe us in the test?” These guys are the stars of the fleet shows they attend because fleet vehicle managers know their operating cost and acquisition cost better than anyone in the passenger car industry because it is their job to know. I heard from their salesman that they do plan on selling into new gliders at the factory in the next couple of years.
      Nick
      • 3 Years Ago
      Not bad actually: Buy a used $10,000 truck, convert it for $30,000 = $40k total....for a truck with similar properties than the Volt.
        Marco Polo
        • 7 Months Ago
        @Nick
        @Nick. But that can be said of almost any conversion. In this case the F100 must be in very good condition and less than 1 months old . So you are looking at a lot more than $10,000. On investigation, by the time the ALTe conversion is on the road, the conversion price is more like $37,000. The real problem, is the love affair the US has with this type of vehicle. Only a small percentage of the vehicles utilise the F-Series design capacities. In a way the US popularity of the SUV and large pick-up truck. is an unintended product of CAFE. Consumer Resistance to driving small, underpowered cars in the US, created the SUV and Large pick-up truck for people who have previously bought large cars, station-waggons and ute's. The popularity of such vehicles and the low cast of manufacture led to a proliferation of vehicle with even less environmental attributes, than before the CAFE regulation were enacted. CAFE, like most government regulation, is well intentioned. However, like most regulations with unintended consequences, they become very hard to repeal. Usually these regulations have developed a vast bureaucratic infrastructure, and vested political interests.
      2 Wheeled Menace
      • 3 Years Ago
      Might be seeing some hobbyists break from the "all electric" mentality and build their own plug-ins, or electric boost systems.. I for one am looking to do just that since i can't really afford a full on electric 4 wheeler.
        Joeviocoe
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        And hobbyists are very UNlikely to be building the ONLY car that is available for them to drive. And very UNlikely to be living in an apartment without a garage. Which are the two reasons people would opt for a PHEV. "Yes, the way I see it, if you're gonna build a time machine into a car, why not do it with some style?" The way I see it, if you're gonna build an EV out of combustion car, why not do it with some practicality?
        2 Wheeled Menace
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        Actually if you have an engine with a balanced crankshaft, and about 20mm of clearance, you can devise a freewheeling electric boost that puts about 10kW-20kW into the power equation. You are only using 10-20 horsepower to cruise on flat land. A small electric motor can do well over half of the work :) Crankshafts are designed to move lots of power. Mounting right off the accessory drive is a perfect place. So yes, it would be extremely easy to do.
          SVX pearlie
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          One can hypermile an eAssist for some additional gain, just like people hypermile hybrids and BEVs... There are still losses tied to conversions, resistance and drag. Hypermiling techniques would minimize those losses for even better mileage.
          SVX pearlie
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          Sorry, *much* less than $5,000. The eAssist option on the Regal was an $800 option, and the MSRP with the increased content and eAssist standard increased the base price by $1,600. So it's probably $800 to $1000 cost to the buyer. Maybe as little as $500 to $600 to GM. If it's $500 in bulk, and GM makes it standard like ABS and Airbags, then the payback is about a year?
          Joeviocoe
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          Okay then. :) But I still doubt that a hobbyist could build an effective eAssist with 25% MPG gain for a cost effective amount. Although, a hypermiler can get the same gains for free. :)
          Joeviocoe
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          Thanks. So 25% increase in MPG for $5000 31 mpg @ $4/gal @ 12000miles/year = $1548 / year 25 mpg @ $4/gal @ 12000miles/year = $1920 / year = $372 /year in savings. = 13 years payback 31 mpg @ $5/gal @ 12000miles/year = $1935 / year 25 mpg @ $5/gal @ 12000miles/year = $2400 / year = $465 /year in savings. = 11 years payback And I seriously doubt that a "Hobbyist" can do the same conversion for less than $10,000. So that doubles the payback time to over 20 Years. Like I said, I doubt that such small gains are worth it. You really need to get some true AER above your commuting distance, (like the Volt) to see real gains. Or get a purposefully designed REAL hybrid like a Prius to gain double MPG... not some measly 25%.
          SVX pearlie
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          GM eAssist is giving +25% improvement to the Buick LaCrosse, from 19/30 to 25/37 (31 avg). Those are pretty darn good numbers for such a big sedan, and almost certainly better than what an eAssist Class 2 work truck would get. Doubling would have been 38/60 (49 avg). For comparison, Prius V is "only" 44/40 (42 avg).
          SVX pearlie
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          Isn't that basically what GM BAS / eAssist does? It's a mild hybrid, as you describe, but it doesn't create 2x efficiency. More like a very cost-effective +1.
          Joeviocoe
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          And at what cost premium from the standard Buick.
          2 Wheeled Menace
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          Yep - it's basically a high powered BAS i'm talking about. You have a massively larger battery; 5kWhr-10kWhr will do the trick; and regen is just bonus range. You don't have to run the engine or regen to charge it up, as that mild boost provides around half the power. At slower speeds you could run on the electric motor alone. BAS would be cool on a GM car if you gave it a really big battery and said 'hey BAS, run all the time'
          Joeviocoe
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          SVX. what are the average MPG gains in a mild hybrid eAssist or GM BAS? And at what price premium over the non-hybrid version? I doubt that garage conversions can get anywhere near that.
          SVX pearlie
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          Thanks, 2WM. Interesting approach, and probably worth looking into. Thing is, if it's a 20 hp motor, you can use it as BEV at low speeds, so you don't really need the ICE. At that point, you're looking at a very rapid stop/start system that probably is more like the Volt / PIP?
          SVX pearlie
          • 3 Years Ago
          @2 Wheeled Menace
          Oh, yeah, eAssist isn't expensive, less than $5k, and fully integrated by the OEM.
        Joeviocoe
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        But supplementing the 20 kW during cruising is a poor use of battery power... like you said.. city driving is where the electric motor needs to do work. But that requires more power for acceleration and regen capture. So 20 kW won't do as much. To use that 20 kW battery power on the highway will quickly deplete the battery with chance for regen. You can make the argument that every little bit helps... but it won't be worth it. To use a battery and motor to supply 10 kW - 20 kW during low speed driving might be comparable to some of the weaker hybrids (mild hybrids) on the road do right now... and the few extra mpg ratings are usually not worth the extra cost. And they are made with cost effective processes from the OEM. A home converter will spend thousands to inject a small amount of battery power and get a little mpg gain in return. The Prius (the only hybrid that truly 'doubles' city mpg) gets such great mpg because of the power split device that allows the engine to run at optimal speeds and on the Atkinson cycle. You cannot just install that into a conversion without redesigning everything.
        2 Wheeled Menace
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        Now if you wanted something more like the Volt, then that's hard. It's also heavy because you are carrying two full size powertrains. I'm talking about a system that would double or triple the fuel efficiency of any ol' car in city driving. Much like a hybrid system that is always on.
        Dan Frederiksen
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        not sure anyone has ever done a good DIY plugin hybrid. if you can afford to make a plugin why not a straight EV?
        Joeviocoe
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        If anything... you want to build it in reverse. Build an EV powertrain. Full size battery, motor to run at all conditions... and then make room for a small gas engine to run at nearly constant output to maintain charge in the battery during cruising on the highway. 10 kW to 20 kW. I still like the idea of a modular system. Pure EV with 80+ miles per charge (always a good idea to double your commuting distance). Then a small, lightweight engine (wankel, microturbine, UAV engine) that can produce 30 HP in a small package. Fit it in the spare tire well or on a small trailer. Use it when needed for longer trips. It can be expensive, but can be shared/rented among many vehicles.
          Joeviocoe
          • 7 Months Ago
          @Joeviocoe
          A full sized sedan with an average Cd can cruise at 75 mph with 20 KW of power... so 30 HP engine could do it. A normal engine needs to be sized twice as large for several reasons: 1) Peak power power for acceleration... not needed in an EREV where peak power is given by the battery. 2) Lower RPMs, fuel economy, durability, noise, etc. For the purposes of only highway cruising, a smaller engine can get away with not needing this. Hence, the bike engine. Yes, motorcycle engines run at higher rpm and are loud. That is why you should put them in back, under the trunk. Like I said, placement is key.
          SVX pearlie
          • 7 Months Ago
          @Joeviocoe
          That 80 hp is what allows the Volt to travel at highway speeds. 50 hp is much less than a 1st gen Ford Focus or 1st gen Festiva (or MIEV, for that matter) in a car that is almost certain to weigh more due to lots of batteries + largish ICE. Also, aren't motorcycle engines both dirty and noisy, requiring very high RPMs for power? If you go from battery to motorcycle, won't that be jarringly super-loud?
          Joeviocoe
          • 7 Months Ago
          @Joeviocoe
          SVX, I agree about the Volt. I was just discussing what a "hobbyist's" conversion could do. Hobbyist's right now can easily exceed 80 miles AER. But with VERY LITTLE room for much else. The Volt has nearly a full sized ICE (80 HP 1.4 L engine for Opel's Family 0 engine)... which was mainly done because the engine is 'off the shelf' and thus cheapest to produce right now. So they went, engine first, battery second. For a hobbyist, engine selection will be vastly different and with more options. A small 50 HP motorcycle engine, if well placed, can do the job. Battery first, engine second.
          SVX pearlie
          • 7 Months Ago
          @Joeviocoe
          That's what the Volt does, although there is a very big difference in range. If you look at Safelite, their reps and techs drive 2000+ miles a month. That's roughly 90 miles per day, and not unreasonable for a tech or rep covering a good size territory. A "real world" 80-mile AER in an EREV translates into roughly 90% of miles on battery. The problem is that the 80-mile battery is more than double what the 35-40 mile AER Volt currently carries. It's probably not feasible until charge density and battery cost improve measurably. OTOH, Safelite is getting high 50s out of their Volts, so that's not a bad thing. Problem is, a Prius C does just as well, and is a lot cheaper (right now). If going to a smaller
        Joeviocoe
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        Making a PHEV from an ICE car is a VERY tough conversion. Technically speaking, it would be VERY difficult to blend two power trains. It's very different from gutting all the ICE components and building an EV from off the shelf components. However, taking an existing hybrid like the Prius and adding a larger battery and plug is much easier and has been done by hundreds already. The closest I've seen to making a hybrid is dual axle drive. An ICE runs the front wheels and an electric motor is installed on the rear wheels. Blending is done by computer.
      2 Wheeled Menace
      • 3 Years Ago
      *shrug* My idea is actually more along the line of what the plug in prius does, except that i will have a lot more battery. But i'll be missing the magic that the prius has.
      2 Wheeled Menace
      • 3 Years Ago
      My thread got super cluttered, so let me post here.. My idea of a DIY hybrid is to have a 5-10kwH battery. It would be vastly more effective than a regular hybrid system - AND it would add quite a bit of extra torque to the car as well. If you can constantly pump out 10-20kW, doing half or more of the work that the gas engine does will obviously result in a 30mpg car to hit 50-60-70mpg constantly, as long as the battery has a charge. Using a gas engine to generate electricity produces a net energy loss versus just putting that gas power down to the wheels. Whenever you convert one form of energy to another, you lose some - this case, 10-20% of your gas engine's output is lost in the generation process as it makes it's way to the battery. Then you lose another 10-20% turning that electric energy into mechanical motion again. The only way you defeat this is to have a super well developed and tuned gas engine running at it's peak efficient RPM at all times. Then you may actually end up gaining some efficiency... only to lose it again, and be right about where you would be putting that gas power to the wheels. A lot of people don't understand that. It doesn't make sense until you get some real world experience, or read some spec sheets etc. There is always a penalty to convert one form of energy to another, even just converting AC to DC, or converting DC to another DC voltage can really lose you some power.
        Joeviocoe
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        Well, I wish anyone attempting this much luck. I just don't think it can be done as cheaply as one might think... and certainly don't think the MPG increase will be that drastic. I would love to see it done though :)
        EZEE
        • 3 Years Ago
        @2 Wheeled Menace
        Your post makes sense, but doesn't it then discount the Volt, as the Volt (and Fisker, for that matter) do exactly what you describe.... Be careful when commenting on the Volt... :o
      Joeviocoe
      • 3 Years Ago
      @4:20 "Initial conversion costs are around $30,000 per vehicle. Price Reductions are planned as production ramps up" That is in ADDITION to the cost of the donor vehicle! "Vehicles accepted are between 3 and 5 years old and MUST meet prescreen requirement before conversion by ALTe" ------------------------ With 25 - 40 (@1:20) miles of maximum range... let's say 32 miles average EV range. And I didn't see a CS Mode MPG rating. The 2010 4.6L V8 (@1:30) gasoline F-150 gets 17 mpg combined. They can save about 1.88 gallons of fuel per day in EV mode. At $4.67/gal average over the next few years (fueleconomy.gov)... that's $8.79 each day.. or about $3,200 in annual fuel savings if driven only 32 miles each day. In CS mode, just a wild guess... But if this serial hybrid can manage 34 mpg combined.. that would be half the cost of the gasoline model which costs about $3,300 each year in fuel assuming 12000 miles/year (fueleconomy.gov). So $1,650/year saved by driving 12000 miles/year in CS mode. So total annual fuel savings would be at least $3,300 (assuming electricity is free). So for this F-150 (driving only in EV mode for 32 miles per day)... Payback of the $30,000 conversion... in about 9 years. If the truck is driven 64 miles each day (23000 miles/year)... that is 32 miles in EV mode and 32 in CS mode ...that is $3,300/yr savings for EV mode + $1,650/yr saving for CS mode. About $5,000/year saved. Best case scenario of A LOT of driving needed (23000 miles per year) ... payback in 6 years. So a 6 to 9 year payback depending on whether on how much you drive each day and over the year.
        EZEE
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Joeviocoe
        Hey Joe (I heard you shot your old lady....shot her down....) Anyway, your math was quite an interesting read. Your conclusion on the mileage, however, was actually quite a positive. Since the rocket exploded, I work in insurance in loss prevention (analysis, employee and public safety, vehicle safety, etc). 23,000 miles a year is not a lot at all for businesses. It is actually a low number. Many businesses, Asa perk, allow employees to drive their vehicles home, use them on the weekend, etc. as such, 30,000 - 50,0000 miles a year is not uncommon. In my case, just traveling to do MY job I drive about 35,000 - 40,000 miles a year (although I have a fusion 4 banger). I get a new car roughly every 2.5 years as a result. So to me, the translogic analysis (along with yours) is very encouraging.
        Joeviocoe
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Joeviocoe
        Oh... and ignoring the cost and time frame of battery replacement. They're using Li-Ion and not NiNH... 22kwh pack... so I'm guessing about 50% DOD utilization so cycle life should be good. But after 10 years, calendar life of Li-Ion should be getting to be a concern. So after 10 years... over $30,000 saved, but maybe another spending another $5,000 on a 22 kwh pack (assuming LiPo costs in 2022 are $225/kwh). But that could be the bulk of the overall depreciation and will be sold to the used-truck market at that point. I know, an assumption within an assumption. AssInssemption!
        Joeviocoe
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Joeviocoe
        Assumptions made: Amazing CS mode of 34 mpg... this is almost what the Volt gets. $4.67/gal average over the next decade... anybody's guess Free electricity... depending on where this fleet is located they could buy power at industrial or commercial rates.
          SVX pearlie
          • 7 Months Ago
          @Joeviocoe
          A F-150 has a much higher CdA (true air drag loss) than a Volt. Probably 2x, and the weight probably has similar increase in rolling resistance, not to mention losses start/stop of heavier mass. CS might be more like 25 mpg for a Class 2 pickup, or 30 mpg for a Class 1 minivan. Vastly better to be sure, but unlikely to be as good as a Volt.
        Kevin Gregerson
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Joeviocoe
        typical scenario for these though. Start, go run for 12 hours a day. With the big battery it gains the ability to be used as a work truck on site without idling all day and charge between job sites. Many guys already pay 5-6k to convert for all day running as a generator. If you got both abilties with some economy to boot it's in a good place. Some of these trucks also do 30-40k a year worth of driving so paybacks in under 5 years are very possible.
          Julius
          • 7 Months Ago
          @Kevin Gregerson
          Here's another point - flip the scenario around: many larger construction work sites (think buildings) have electricity provided or available. Bring a portable charger, and you can recharge the vehicle on-site and potentially expand the electric-only range over what can be done if it was charged at home base alone.
        DaveMart
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Joeviocoe
        @Joe: I have found what I presume to be the relevant section of the website you reference: http://www.eia.gov/forecasts/steo/#US_Crude_Oil_And_Liquid_Fuels Most of their forecasts there go out no further than 2013, and nowhere could I find a reference to the projection of $4.67/gallon, looking through or using Google search. If you have any more information I would be grateful.
          Joeviocoe
          • 7 Months Ago
          @DaveMart
          In order to make a fair comparison, you kinda have to pick a number to be the average price per gallon over the course of the payback time. Many people choose a nice round number like $5/gal.. But that is just as much an assumption. When choosing a vehicle with better fuel economy, one has to weigh the costs. And the prices to convert to better fuel economy or any Alt. fuel vehicle are paid right now, while the savings are made over the decade... so a person becomes a speculator about future gasoline prices anyway.
          Joeviocoe
          • 7 Months Ago
          @DaveMart
          I don't fancy it either... but as a comparison, it was best I could do. The economics concerning future oil prices and battery costs... are two of the worst metrics to predict. And they are a major component in any calculation.
          DaveMart
          • 7 Months Ago
          @DaveMart
          Thanks. I don't think I fancy that methodology, but thanks anyway!
          Joeviocoe
          • 7 Months Ago
          @DaveMart
          Just by taking the fueleconomy.gov estimated annual fuel costs for any given vehicle... and use that with the 12000 miles driven each year average for American passenger cars and the EPA given MPG. Like I said, assumption. But that is really anybody's guess.
        Marco Polo
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Joeviocoe
        @ Joeviocoe, You are quite correct ! If anything, you are far too generous regarding the economic benefits of this sort of conversion ! In addition the purchaser has to gamble that Ford, GM etc will not produce a more efficient model in the next 6 years, cheaper than $30,000 + for a converted vehicle. I don't understand the Fleet owner who asks Ford for a 4 cylinder F-series to deliver potato chips ? Why wouldn't he simply purchase a more suitable 4 cylinder vehicle, with the same load capacity, from the large number of model available on the market ? The cost of the new vehicle would be less than $30,000 ! But hey, if these guys can make money out of this business, more power to them !
        DaveMart
        • 3 Years Ago
        @Joeviocoe
        Joe, have you an exact reference for the $4.67 future fuel economy projection? I couldn't find it by searching the site, and it is a critical figure for working out the economics of electric cars. Thanks.
          Joeviocoe
          • 7 Months Ago
          @DaveMart
          Just by taking the fueleconomy.gov estimated annual fuel costs... and use that with the 12000 miles driven each year average for American passenger cars and the EPA given MPG. Like I said, assumption. But that is really anybody's guess.
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