More details leak out about Porsche's reported plan for entry level model
Remember the Porsche 914? Most Porschophiles do, although some choose to forget the mid-engined sportscar built from 1969 through 1976. But the four-cylinder model was something of a sales success for the German automaker, handily outpacing the firm's range-topping 911 series throughout its model run. Might we see a return of the entry-level Porsche, once again with a little help from Volkswagen?
Coinciding with earlier reports, a story from Automobilwoche (via Drive), says the answer may very well be 'yes.' According to the German pub, Wolfgang Duerheimer, head of development at Porsche, has said that a model "significantly cheaper than" the Boxster is a top priority for the automaker. The new car would reportedly be produced in cooperation with Volkswagen, which recently assimilated Porsche into its giant European operations. Anyone else thinking BlueSport?
[Source: Automobilwoche via drive.com.au | Photo: Spurzem CC.2.0]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
A Porsche Fan 5:37PM (10/05/2009)
This would be in compliance with the "new 356" theory too. It would be cool for Porsche to build something with VW based on the bluesport, but remember that the VW-cooperated 914 and 924 were some of the least successful models Porsche ever made.
Reply
JLevy 6:31PM (10/05/2009)
If you define "success" by numbers sold, you are incorrect. Read the article and you will see that the '14 outsold the '11 during the years it was produced.
And that picture makes me miss the heck out of my 1975 orange 1.8 that I bought new in '75. It was a stripper (I was all of 19 years old and it was all I could afford) but it turned me on to sports cars, Porsches (I've owned 4 of 'em since) and mid-engine cars in general.
montoym 6:39PM (10/05/2009)
The story begs to differ,
- "But the four-cylinder model was something of a sales success for the German automaker, handily outpacing the firm's range-topping 911 series throughout its model run." -
If the 914 was a sales failure, what then was the even lower-selling 911 of the time?
In terms of how they're thought of nowadays, you may be right as they tend to be somewhat unloved, but they were absolutely a sales success in their time.
BoxerFanatic 5:44PM (10/05/2009)
First off, as 914s go.. that is a gorgeous one.
But Porsche does not need to go down this road again.
An entry level Porsche is a USED Porsche.
If it is being done with VW... chances are it will have an inline, vertical firing, transverse mounted engine. BLASPHEMY.
Any Porsche that has two seats should have a boxer engine, or a good reason to have a bigger engine than a flat 6, like Carrera GT's race-grade V10.
Please don't put a Porsche crest on a car that should be a VW or an Audi.
Boxster and Cayman make a great starting point to the Porsche lineup.
If anything, bring back the front engined water-coolers. slat 4, Turbo, then V8 and Twin Turbo, rear PDK transaxle, rear drive... heck with Cayman's gearbox and suspension directly... behind a torque-tube driveshaft. Make a new 944/968 and 928, as grand touring 2+2s at a price under 997 Carrera.
Reply
zamafir 5:56PM (10/05/2009)
"But Porsche does not need to go down this road again."
You have been reading reports of porsche's financial status and where their sales are going right? From a Porsche fanboi/enthusiast perspective, I totally understand where you're coming from. From a business perspective? Not so much. Which is why they’re pursuing more platform sharing with VW. It doesn’t seem that bad, just drop something cookie in the blusport, sell it for 35k and you’re good to go. In typical banal portion fashion it’ll slot just below the boxter in performance.
Awe crap, you’re right. Porsche shouldn’t do this. 35k, sub boxter performance? In the increasingly crowded 370z et-al price bracket. I’m not so sure they can move the volume they’d need to, especially to make a solid business case of it.
GeoSB8K 6:02PM (10/05/2009)
Agreed. Bring back the 944 (turbo) please. I've owned a few Porsches and I can tell you that the boxster and 911 are (wonderful) toys. The 911 can handle a couple of small kids, the boxster can't even do that. The cayman, well, I did manage to bring home a miter saw from Home Depot in the back, but I did get a few looks. Point being, in a down market and entry level car needs to be useable. I used to track a 944 Turbo (951) but I could also pull lunch duty as well as use the hatchback for bringing home larger items. Its a great do it all car and I would love to see Porsche build an updated version of a 944 or 968 again.
TonyInMI 6:07PM (10/05/2009)
@Zamafir - in the short term your "business" case makes sense - maybe they'd sell. In the long term it waters down the brand. Bad idea.
BoxerFanatic 6:08PM (10/05/2009)
That is part of what I am saying.
This would be a car that would basically be a mid-engined Audi TT. Probably good chassis balance, but probably small, and probably of limited practicality and appeal.
That sort of formula works as a bit of a halo special... or something to diversify an otherwise mainstream lineup...
But all it does is dilute Porsche. Porsche has better 2 seaters than that right now, and anyone wanting a real porsche will not step down to less, and frankly as one of those, I would rather buy a BETTER CAR USED, than a compromised car new.
I have no problem with VW competing there. That would be on the upper side of their mainstream market. A junior R4 below an R8, and replacing TT, would also offer something nice for Audi, along side the big A5 coupe, and A4 and A6 sedans, and be a nice car for those who aspire, but can't reach an R8.
But all it does is put the Porsche crest on a car that probably won't be the best in class. Porsche does not need that.
If Porsche wants to DIVERSIFY, rather than just go down-market and shoot themselves in the foot... A set of Grand Touring Coupe 2+2 cars, like I mentioned above. Something between G37 and Porsche's own Carrera 2, and Jag XK... maybe ruffle BMW's 3-series and base 6-series feathers a bit.
Something sleeker and more performance-focused than A5/S5, and predominantly RWD. The balance of a rear-mounted transaxle trumping complex and heavy AWD, like Panamera has, which is a nice system... but perhaps not really worth the weight and the front-heavy balance point.
zamafir 11:05PM (10/05/2009)
@BoxerFanatic- good points. it seems vw's getting lazy. a premium blusport would moot the TT, porsche's already rear or mid engine, so they'll just sell 'em there at a bit of a premium. lame.
new idea. just the blusport. 2.0T form the GTI, Golf R, and 2.5T from the TT-RS. done and done. :). Though I'm curious if anyone would buy a TT-RS over a mid engine equivalent :)
auto.design 5:44PM (10/05/2009)
Fine, as long as VW puts the Bluesport into production. Soon.
Reply
My_SS_RX8 5:45PM (10/05/2009)
the Cayman is about as entry level as Porsche gets, and it can nearly be optioned into 911 territory. so lets see where this goes....
Reply
Sean 5:46PM (10/05/2009)
Entry level price for a Porsche would be... $30K? $40K?
I ask in all honesty, as I have no earthly idea.
Reply
Scott 5:59PM (10/05/2009)
Since the Boxster starts around $40k, and they said significantly cheaper...
JMills 5:47PM (10/05/2009)
I have no problem with this. I've always liked the 914, more so than the 924/944/968. As long as they make it mid-engined, or even rear engined and sexy I'll be happy. Sexy is the key though, keep the Panamera's stylist away from the project.
Reply
G.G. 4:10PM (10/06/2009)
JMills,
Michael Mauer is the name of the chief stylist who created the Panamera. It's going to be a problem to keep him off the entry level Porsche project considering he is the head of the Style Department. But it does seem that Mauer likes creating huge cars with horrible proportions since he created the C140 Mercedes S-Class coupe from the 90's.
It was Steve Murket, though, who designed the Porsche Cayenne. Both of them still work there. Anatole Lapin created the 928 and he is gone. Harm Lagaay did the 924 and 944, but he is gone too. Grant Larsen created the Boxster and thankfully is still there so there is a chance for some greatness to happen at Porsche once again. That all depends is if his boss, Michael Mauer, gives him the same freedom he once had under Lagaay when he did the original Boxster concept for Geneva.
G.G. 5:45PM (10/06/2009)
It's Anatole Lapine, with an "e" at the end. Excuse me.
artandcolour 6:01PM (10/05/2009)
http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c40/artandcolour2006/Photochops/porsche914.jpg
Reply
IRONFIST 6:01PM (10/05/2009)
Uh, doesn't Porsche already have an entry level model named the Boxster, aka, the Porsche for people who couldn't afford a Porsche to begin with?
Reply
BoxerFanatic 6:34PM (10/05/2009)
Frankly, I like Boxster, and is right at where Porsche should start. Other than that I agree with what I think you are getting at, that Porsche doesn't need to go down market any further. That is VW and Audi territory, and they should work that, and let Porsche do what Porsche does.
But let's compare 987 to 997...
2-seat body rather than 2+2.
mid-engined rather than rear.
Both are well styled, Boxster being reminiscent of the 550 and 718RSK, rather than a 911.
And cayman the same formula with a nice, stiff structure due to the roof.
If they were to build a blue-sport like car, lets compare that to existing 987...
It would be cheaper.
It would still be 2-seats, and thus still small, and of limited practicality, and somewhat redundant of role.
Mid-engined, but transverse, and thus off-set, and not equal-length driveshafts, and short suspension length, where 987 is inherently more balanced with a lower boxer-engine CG, and symmetrical drivetrain.
Probably not as fast as the 370Z if it uses a VW engine (Porsche has no transverse inline drivetrains) and probably not as good at handling as Porsche's own 987...
Why should they have a car with a redundant purpose, inferior power to the competition, and inferior performance to one of their own existing products... just to have something with a certain price point with a Porsche crest on it?
Why not have the four rings on it instead, or the VW circle? the car would not be redundant in those brands, and would not be eclipsed by a better car just above it, from day one.
What is next? putting the Porsche crest on a golf cart, or a pick up truck, just so that they can say they have one?
It is more than just the price point... it is the PURPOSE of the vehicle.
The Porsche 914 was a good car. It had a mid-engine drivetrain, and a boxer engine, and was not redundant. There was no intermediate step of a better mid-engined car between 914 and 911, it was just those two.
If anything, a Boxster is the new 914, done FAR more correctly for Porsche than 914 was done by VW/Porsche, and then VW deciding not to sell the car, leaving Porsche to sell it alone.
The third model in the 1970s was not a redundant car between 911 and 914, it was a 928, and another failed co-op in the 924, which was developed with Audi, and they backed out, too.
It would have been a good Audi, but it made a lackluster Porsche. They have learned this lesson before. The 944 only really took off once it got a Porsche-grade interior, and an upgraded engine, and the availability of a turbo model, then a DOHC and Variocam 3.0 Liter I4 in the 968...
Porsche needs to design it's own cars. When VW and Audi try to co-op, they have backed out, leaving Porsche holding the bag, and then trying to design cars that they had to compromise during the co-op design stage.
Let's not repeat that. If we have to repeat it... repeat the GOOD models. The 944 Turbo (951)... the S2, and 968... the big bruiser 928 V8... Porsche has some V8 cooking...
Take the Cayenne/Panamera chassis to the plastic surgeon, cut it down to size, set it up for Cayman's rear gearbox and rear suspension components and a hatchback, and Panamera's front engine... push the front axle line forward of the engine...
Then Porsche needs to learn what it did wrong with the Panamera's styling, and de-bulk the car, and re-curve a shorter fastback coupe roof, so not to have a visible flat spot in the middle, but not as crazy with the compound curves as Cayman's roof... 997 has a great roofline... They can do it.
Art 6:07PM (10/05/2009)
a porsche "significantly" cheaper than the boxster? well that clues us into one thing-for sure going to use the VW 2.0T. no other way to cut $ in the powertrain department-if porsche independently developed a 4cyl, that R&D would diminish the cost saving
Reply