its nice that they are going to bring us new products, but wouldn't new jobs be better?

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It is obvious the direction that GM is heading, and it doesn't include American labor, at least not at this point.

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It's great to see GM investing money where it SHOULD be investing money...small cars. The future.

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Dear Bob Lutz,

Please bring us OPELS, and not DAEWOOS, as a small car for the U.S.

Did you hear me? O - P - E - L - S.

They may also be known as VAUXHALLS and HOLDENS, and in some places, are called CHEVROLETS.

I think there may be links to Opel's website from GM's page. Bob -- I'll send you the link if you need it.

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"It is obvious the direction that GM is heading, and it doesn't include American labor, at least not at this point"

What a joke, are you kidding? Toyota is ready to squash all the big three, and its not because they build a better vehicle now days. Its because they are more sneaky. While they "Assemble" a few vehicles here in America, in a few different plants, they have ship loads and ship loads of cars and parts pouring in to this country. And they tell the stupid americans, look, we care about you and your country...wake up people, well its a little to late now. And heres GM and Ford paying for retirement and medical to Millions, yes MILLIONS of retired workers, and it cost them (Billions) a year. So just keep buying the imports, put GM, Ford out of business, and you then stopped retirement checks to millions of americans. What do you think will happen after that..Wake up..its starting

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Live2redline,

American car companies have to compete on a world market, if not we will be stuck with whatever the American car companies wish to make and sell us, at the price they want to sell it to us for. Americans' keep thinking we are number one in everything, but that has been slipping away for years. You are right America needs to wake-up, but that doesn't mean all will go back to the way is was...those days are gone forever. The days of a secure retirement from the company you worked for are long gone. You cannot blame that on the Japanese. Face it, America just cannot compete any longer in the automotive business. You are telling me that I am supposed to subsidize Ford and GM's retiree medical obligations by buying their cars? Wow! Aren't the following generations to come going to be saddled with war bills that they don't deserve, and could have prevented? Hey, last time I looked this is a Capitalist market, and we shove it down other countries throats as well. I'll put my money where it yield the best return, and if foreign car companies provide me with that then I will do just that—it is the Capitalist way. The line about "more sneaky" was hilarious. Truly hilarious...can you say Carl Rove? LOL

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F451,

"American car companies have to compete on a world market,"

So you hit them for not having American jobs to build the small cars anyway? I.e. everyone else building the small cars are competing in the world market by making small cars outside the U.S. I like American jobs too but if even Toyota, who loves the PR of North American jobs, can't build the Yaris here (and Honda the Fit, two companies that make most of their world wide PROFIT in the U.S., i.e. it is worth them investing here) it is not a wonder why GM doesn't build the small cars here. It would be great if they did build the small cars here but Saturn lost money and the S-Series was always underrated IMO which causes no faith for GM in building a small car here ever again.

But I think it most appropriate if people who actually buy GM and Ford products demand U.S. made products more-so than the import fanboys who never step foot on a GM or Ford dealer (to never help them make profit one to even consider making a small car here) Don't assume I am talking directly to you either, I don't know what you drive.



"if not we will be stuck with whatever the American car companies wish to make and sell us, at the price they want to sell it to us for."

Yes, with in-the-box thinking this is true. With any bit of imagination one could see other Americans starting American companies to build cars because they weren't happy with GM and Ford offerings. Bill Gates seems to be into cars enough to import Porsches that need special permission to come over here. Hell, he should take that love for cars and his management skills and start a car company (or buy Chrysler and get a head start). The truth is, Bill Gates is affraid of Toyota. Hell, why shouldn't he be? I have co-workers with failing X-Box' left and right. MS can't do the hardware thing very well, they should stick with software I guess.



"Americans' keep thinking we are number one in everything, but that has been slipping away for years."

Interesting points. First you state (in essence) Americans would have to accept the crap GM and Ford give us if we tried to buy American and now you say how Americans (in general, in every field is the implication, correct?) are slipping. I guess it is OK for "slipping" Americans (i.e. those who are not doing as good-a-job as they used to) to still demand the best still even they themselves are slipping? Of course it is, that is the American way: Do as I say and not as I do.



"I'll put my money where it yield the best return, and if foreign car companies provide me with that then I will do just that—it is the Capitalist way."

Yup, the American Way used to be build the better mouse trap. Now it is buy the perceived better foreign product. Much more effective. Yup, if Honda and Toyoda thought that way decades ago (to just buy the better foreign U.S. cars instead of building a better mouse trap) life surely would be different now wouldn't it?


"I'll put my money where it yield the best return,"

You mean like with companies that start a factory with 2000 jobs in the same couple months that 10000 jobs were destroyed in the same industry. Please don't waste your time writing how they aren't related. As if Toyota's sales are not eating into the U.S. domestic company's. Great investment. You're right, you potentially saving some dough in resale value if you sold your car sooner than later is definitely worth all the loss of jobs. Great investment, you're a regular Warren Buffet.

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Lithous,

Both Honda and Toyota have put substantial emphasis in their brain trust, and it has paid-off. Yet, people, like you, lambast them for putting the work, energy, and time into it, and seeing the payoff. Worse is using the pathetic propaganda "loss of jobs" card to encourage people to buy what they don't want or make poor investments. Had American car manufacturers' made what Americans wanted, Americans would have bought them. You're out of touch, and you are promoting American mediocrity through nationalism (although in a coy manner, I'll give you that).

Analogous to the easy credit that is taking down home buyers, America cannot pull a rabbit out of a hat and even remotely hope to makeup for the time they did not spend for the betterment of their businesses. When American car companies have proven themselves—I'll happily buy, but not until then. Another very valid question is whether America should even be in the car business any longer, versus putting its talent in other markets? Who ever determined that America had to build cars?

And if you haven't figured it out yet, money is a universal language. Apparently...you don't invest.

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"Both Honda and Toyota have put substantial emphasis in their brain trust, and it has paid-off."

GM has huge R&D going on. OnStar, Heads Up Display, Sisplacement On Demand, EV1 had about 3 times the horse power of the RAV4 EV, GM's first hybrid system (in production in buses for years now) was eons ahead of Toyota and Honda hybrids (the 2002 Civic hybrid is weak), 4wd in the GMC Envoy (and Jimmy before it) is awesome with many selectable drive-train configurations (A4WD, 4Hi, 4Lo, 2Hi - what does Honda have that is compatible?), Night Vision in production Caddys already, G6 Hardtop for the price of the overrated Solara, Envoy XUV is everything the Ridgeline is plus extras because of the cool mid-gate and rear gate that could open two different ways, the skateboard platform, Fuel Cell technology that Toyota wanted to joint venture with just to name a few things.

You are ridiculous to not understand the the brain power at GM. The only reason it hasn't paid off for GM as much is because people like you that want to see only the good in the Japanese and the bad in the U.S. domestic auto companies.



"Yet, people, like you, lambast them for putting the work, energy, and time into it, and seeing the payoff."

Yup, that is themm, all good. No, they (the Toyota execs) don't tell the assembly workers in America that the key to greatness is letting the mistakes be out in the open, well, unless it is a mistake by corporate (as in not admitting sludge problems and probes in Japan about keeping the truth from customers). Yet you can lambast GM all day long even though they have things that no one else has. OnStar alone is so awesome that Lexus link and Acura used it. Glad to see I'm the bad one for lambasting the Trojan Horse transplants and you are the great one for ignoring U.S. company innovations. I'm so bad and you are so perfect and good.



"Worse is using the pathetic propaganda "loss of jobs" card to encourage people to buy what they don't want or make poor investments."

So for something to be propaganda does it not have to be basically untrue? What about the TOTAL NUMBER OF U.S. AUTOMOTIVE JOBS HAS GONE DOWN SIGNIFICANTLY OVER THE YEARS do you not want to open your eyes to? So, people don't want American cars? Isn't GM still over a million units more than Toyota in the U.S. and about 2.5 million units ahead of Honda in the U.S.? Believe me, people want GM vehicles but so many are brainwashed that it has an impact. I'm sure their life is so much better with the family riding around in the Honda minivan with known transmission problems or the Toyota sludge problems. That's right, Honda will fix under warranty after the family gets stuck in the middle of the highway or nowhere.



"Had American car manufacturers' made what Americans wanted, Americans would have bought them."

Americans do buy the cars dumbass. The reason why individaul models outsell the American companies is because they share cars across many divisions. I think it would be a lot closer than you think if you add up the Malibu, G6, Aura (and possibly the Impala since they broke the middle size into two vehicle platforms like Ford did with the Fusion and 500 (while both have the bigger Lucerne and Crown Vic to go against the Avalon). Because of LEGACY dealerships and FRANCHISE LAWS GM has to feed the many divisions (or lose billions like they did getting out of the Olds contracts) and so the numbers are very misleading. Americans do like the domestic cars. Period. And you can throw all the propadanda out you want until more than Toyota even (i.e. not just one but more than one Japanese company) can outsell the domestics at home with total units. And we all know that fleet is a double edged sword. It adds sales but always steers many people away from a retail sale that don't want the stigma so that is a wash. Besides I can show you U.S. military Camrys in fleet.



"You're out of touch, and you are promoting American mediocrity through nationalism (although in a coy manner, I'll give you that)."

No, I know a ton more than you do about what is going on apparently or else you wouldn't do a wholesale dismissal of all the brain work GM does. Whereas it is in my face everyday the things the Japanese do. You are out of touch for sure. You want to imply GM is the position they are in for 80% the wrong reasons.

So, if I call out all the mediocre Americans and say you don't deserve a break today (thank you very much McDonald's) then I am promoting mediacrity? Or am I being a realist and demanding that people starting stepping it up OR don't be a Terrell Owens: put up or shut up. Yup, that is promoting medicrity. What about Toyoda and Honda (the people) not buying foreign to teach Isuzu and Datsun (and actually doing something about it themselves) don't you get? That is promoting mediocrity? How about it is telling people to do something like that (instead of the easy thing of going to the local Toyota dealer) if you really and truly care about your ride? Of course you want to spin it. But the TRUTH is IT IS EASIER TO GO BUY A CAR FROM THE TOYOTA OR HONDA DEALER THAN DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT YOURSELF (including invent something and sell it to GM or Ford all the way up to having your own car company like Tesla is attempting)


So, tell me how going to your local Toyota dealer (instead of the good-ole-days of creating your own mouse trap) is in any way not promoting mediocrity? It is taking the easy way out. PERIOD.



"When American car companies have proven themselves—I'll happily buy, but not until then."

Proven themselves. Whatever. The bar will always change just to meet your needs of not buying American. You know, for years it was, "When American cars are as good". Now it is, "When American cars are better". Next it will be, "When American cars have been better for 10 years so I know for sure they are really better". Bull S.


How in the F can an American car be worse than the transmission failure waiting to happen or the sludge-o-rama? The truth is there are American cars that are easily as reliable and meet the needs. Like the Lucerne. The main engine is extremely reliable but, of course, it is not "technologically advanced enough". Yeah right. Like 95% of the people who buy an Avalon would even know the difference if some import fanboy didn't tell them otherwise. A ton of people don't lift up the hood ever, why would they really care? The answer is they don't but they are brainwashed to care.



"Another very valid question is whether America should even be in the car business any longer, versus putting its talent in other markets? Who ever determined that America had to build cars?"

You are right. Let's throw away every industry. Because any country with anytime of desire will want to make money and if an American company moves to the next thing then they will be right there. Motorola is case in point. Moved from a car radio maker to transitor radio maker to TV maker to cell phones to computer chips and now they bought companies to get the cable box manufacturing going. Just keep moving and each time someone will come to eat your lunch. How does this happen to just about every American company? People like you who think they are so F'ing good at what they do and state things like "my hard earned money" when you haven't worked a hard days work nearly as hard as early 1900 Americans and you get more money than say a Mexican to do the same job because of previous Americans (building the infrastructure) not because anything you did.



"And if you haven't figured it out yet, money is a universal language. Apparently...you don't invest."

I just don't buy into selling out ones mother to get money. Is that so hard to understand?

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Lithous,

Cute, but the reality is that if all you say were true—it would show. You sound very much like those who want less government (e.g. less taxes, blah, blah, blah) in their lives, and then flip-flop demanding governmental intervention when the waters get rough (e.g. By God, we need to stop the influx of foreign competition through regulation!).

I have faith in America; America cannot always be on top (study your world history); America needs time to rebuild. The world has changed, and you want isolationism, but only when convenient, and only when in America's favor. Yeah right.

"I just don't buy into selling out ones mother to get money."

You'd better take a good hard look at your own government! The boys in DC have been doing a pretty good job of doing just that! Is that so hard to understand?

Take a further look at American history and you find that Ford, and other major U.S. corporations shunned Edwards Deming while Japan embraced him and his philosophy. Peter Drucker (one of the most internationally revered business minds of all time) studied and warned—decades ago—the American automotive industries of their shortfalls, and they kept practicing them leading to today's situation. It is people like you who are desperately holding on to what has long since gone rather than roll-up your sleeves and start the hardwork of rebuilding for tomorrow.

Hey, but keep supporting those failing industries, because they're American, versus actually requiring them to become competitive or evolve into a new business. There is nothing in the U.S. Constitution that states you have to be smart to be an American—your case in point. This isn't Mayberry R.F.D.

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GM is learning that to be competitive they have to leave the USA to get their cars. Hopefully Toyota is not doing the reverse. There are enough Americans that don't have the mentality to suffer through what their remaining car companies had put them through. Only a fool would think that US cars has to be bought by all Americans. GM is realizing that not all Americans are fools. Daewoo will benefit but GM will more so.

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"You sound very much like those who want less government (e.g. less taxes, blah, blah, blah) in their lives, and then flip-flop demanding governmental intervention when the waters get rough (e.g. By God, we need to stop the influx of foreign competition through regulation!)."

That is ridiculous to assume as I take things on a case by case basis. I don't do wholesale: the gov't needs to be smaller. So no, your assumption is wrong. Cute, but wrong.


"By God, we need to stop the influx of foreign competition through regulation!"

Not at all. I believe educated Americans can govern themselves. The problem is that people like you are only educated by McDonald's commercials obviously (that you work so hard and deserve a break today). So you think you are the S and you aren't. Deep down you know this but will never admit it. That is the first step in correcting the problem is admitting there is one BTW.

So the problem is that people still think this is the 1970's and GM hasn't done anything. I like how you have no response to most of the things I state. Like all the things GM has invested in (like billions in hybrid and fuel cells). You just want to keep spewing that GM has done nothing and the Japanese everything for the last 40 years.



"The world has changed, and you want isolationism, but only when convenient, and only when in America's favor. Yeah right."

First of all, I never mentioned isolation. Um, people can have friends from all over the world. People can travel all over the world (to and from the U.S.). When it comes to jobs the RULE (NOT LAW as you confuse what I think people should think about doing to incorrect assumption of "forced to do") should be put up or shut up (no, not by law, we can still have freedom of speech by law but more self governing the "do as I say and not as I do" crap that is ruining America)



"You'd better take a good hard look at your own government! The boys in DC have been doing a pretty good job of doing just that! Is that so hard to understand?"

I see, now you are complaining about gov't. So, what are you waiting for? Since you won't invent anything to sell to GM or Ford and won't start your own car company you obviously have time to run for office and do things differently and change that. I see, YOU JUST HAVE A HISTORY OF COMPLAINING ABOUT THINGS AND DOING NOTHING ABOUT IT.



"Take a further look at American history and you find that Ford, and other major U.S. corporations shunned Edwards Deming while Japan embraced him and his philosophy."

Yes, because Deming was god. So, how do we know that it was Deming and not the Japanese gov't and banks and industry (keiretsu anyone?) banding together along with dumping and any other tactic. How do we know it wasn't that and it was Deming? I mean, Deming never showed anyone how it was done with actual manufacturing himself. Matter of a fact, if Deming had then wouldn't he be making the $12Billion plus profits a year Toyota is now and not whatever much smaller amount the Deming company is making now? Of course. So we really will never know (since Deming didn't manufacture anything himself) what the real reason is for Japan Inc's success. Go ask the head of Toyota if Deming was the main reason they are where they are today. I'm sure the answer will be a "yes" without any hesitation.



"Peter Drucker (one of the most internationally revered business minds of all time) studied and warned—decades ago—the American automotive industries of their shortfalls, and they kept practicing them leading to today's situation."

Kept practicing them? Have you ever heard of Saturn? GM started a new company from the ground up IN ORDER TO DO THINGS DIFFERENTLY. You are blind and dumb and clueless. You have listened to every import fanboy over the years and you are so far gone that you can't see the truth.




"It is people like you who are desperately holding on to what has long since gone rather than roll-up your sleeves and start the hardwork of rebuilding for tomorrow."

Sorry if I don't roll my sleeves up and go buy a Toyota. I know that is such hard work but rebuilding tomorrow with such hard work (again, of buying a Toyota) is just way too hard. I'll leave the rebuilding of America to the hard workers like you who put that extra effort into buying foreign everytime. Sorry, I can't do such a difficult task.



"Hey, but keep supporting those failing industries, because they're American, versus actually requiring them to become competitive or evolve into a new business."

Yup, the smarter Japanese (according to people like you, you know, they were smart enough to listen to Deming, um, when not just the American auto companies, many American companies didn't, so they must be smarter) supported their vehicles even when their vehicles were not as good. The German gov't owns part of VW. The "smarter" countries sure do / have done things that are all so bad according to you. I guess they see a need for protection at least sometimes.



"There is nothing in the U.S. Constitution that states you have to be smart to be an American—your case in point. This isn't Mayberry R.F.D."

I have obviously wiped your ass up and down the court between last night and today. You can't break anything down. Just do wholesale, same old, same old, import fanboy statements. You assume things that are wrong. Period. You want to continue in the art of Me Me Me and you throw out the things you've heard over the last 30 to justify it. Whatever.

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Your Stars and stripes are showing Lithous but it don't wash any more. The USA was the first to start a global market and the biggest investors in foreign assets. Now you complain when the table changes. It is the USA that is their own undoing. No thought was made when US corporations took over smaller foreign ones. You didn't complain of the unfair advantage then. Welcome to the real world Lithous. You are sleeping in the bed others were forced to lie in and your crying, is no worse then theirs. Perhaps you can experience what others have experienced in other countries and you can learn why Americans have become disliked. You can say your country "gave them jobs". Well the laugh on you is that the Japanese can now say the same thing.

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