Honda gaining momentum on the Big 2.5
Unless your current residence is beneath the Earth's crust, you probably know about the beating Toyota has been laying on the domestic automakers. Almost every month, Toyota's sales rise by double-digits while the Detroit-based competition endures losses. It seems there's constant debate over which US location at which Toyota will build its next assembly plant, and the gang from Aichi has a good chance to become the world's largest automotive manufacturer by sales volume in 2007.
Honda, too, has seen a steady climb in US market share with volume rising 50% in the past 10 years. Overall volume in the United States is now at 1.5 million units and Honda doesn't even have full-size trucks and SUVs like the competition. It's looking to expand its offerings with a planned V10 supercar and a new, more powerful Accord coming stateside by year's end. Incentive spending has been right around Toyota's levels also, with total spend at about 1/3 of the competition. Honda is also the technological leader in many non-automotive areas, with 12.7 million motorcycle sales in 2006 in addition to other businesses including robots, power equipment, and aircraft.
The automaker is also scoring high marks for quality. In the Consumer Reports 2007 Top Picks, Honda scored winners with Fit, Civic, and Accord -- a sweep in the volume passenger car categories. Positive results in JD Power initial and long-term quality studies have also helped keep resale values much higher than the domestic competition.
With domestic automakers taking aim at Toyota in a bids to gain back lost ground, they'd be well advised not to forget about Honda as well. Each year, it takes a little more share away from Detroit while flying under the radar asToyota registers as the 800 lb. bogey.
[Source: Detroit News]
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Aetius 9:59AM (3/11/2007)
If only they could figure out the mysteries of design and torque.
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dejal 10:02AM (3/11/2007)
"If only they could figure out the mysteries of design and torque"
And yet every year they eat a little bit more of the big 3 , sorry, 2.5, oops, 2.12343532.
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Stéphane Dumas 10:29AM (3/11/2007)
I begin to be worried about their future "oligopoly", also in Quebec, Canada. Hondas begins to morph slowly but surely into "grannys grocery-getter" because I saw often lots of grandmas and grandpas driving Civics and mainly Accords. The improvements and addition of high technology can be a double-edge knife. Each time they improve them with high-tech stuffs, they seems, at least to my eyes, to remove each bit of what was their souls and personnalities to became more "appliance" with less passion. Then the Prelude disseapeared from the scene... and the chances to see the Prelude back like Nissan Z-cars did are slim :_(
When I saw the Mazda 3 and Mazda 6, they reminds me of what the Accords and Civics was in the past.
Also, does Honda have to worry about Hyundai as well? I spotted at another forum, this link to a spy shot of the full-size RWD Hyundai
http://thecarblogger.blogspot.com/2007/03/spy-shots-2008-hyundai-bh-rwd.html who's planned to be show at the New York Auto Show
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Gavin 10:34AM (3/11/2007)
Did'nt Saturn post gains in sales of almost 60% in February compared to February of 2006, & GM 3.4%?
I don't think GM is continuing to endure 'huge losses' with its bout of new and respectable products...
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Michael Karesh 11:12AM (3/11/2007)
I think we can count on the V10 supercar being a big contributor to their sales volumes. Except that other news reports say they've gone back to the drawing board with it.
Most Hondas are reliable, but in my research at TrueDelta the 2006 Civic isn't doing so well. Its repair rates so far are about twice that of other Hondas I'm tracking, which puts it just a bit ahead of the typical domestic.
http://www.truedelta.com/results1206.php
Many V6-powered 1999-2003 Hondas have also experienced transmission failures. But at least Honda warranties them to 109,000 miles as part of a class action suit settlement.
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Gardiner Westbound 11:19AM (3/11/2007)
I have viewed Honda as the "engineers" automobile company. Its engineers seem to have the final say, accounting for some Hondas' quirky styling. They seem to be superior technically to arch rival Toyota's wares and are nicer to drive.
However, No. 3 is right. With each succeeding Honda model the engineering influence retreats. The deline started with the elimination of the Civic's double wishbone suspension and continues.
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carnut 11:24AM (3/11/2007)
I don't get it - Honda can't build a decent automatic (the majority sold in the USA), has to be drug kicking and screaming to fix them and yet people think they are reliable?
Sorry, but a TRANSMISSION is a major part of the car and after all these years, Honda still can't build them right. Ask an 04 TL owner how their trans is holding up. Same old same old.
I just don't get it - if Ford, GM, or Chrysler had major transmission issues we'd cry bloody murder. But Toyota with the #1 recalls last year and Honda with exploding transmissions gain sales? Very weird.
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Sid 11:52AM (3/11/2007)
I agree, Michael. When I was shopping for my car, I test drove the Mazda3 and Civic back to back. Right out the gate, the Civic's dash didn't agree with me. Then, I pushed it hard through a on-ramp and the AT didn't keep up and the shifts were jerky. And even thought the handling was surprisingly good, the brakes were squishy.
Then I drove the Mazda3 and it was like I was driving a car from a different segment. Top-notch interior, SOLID brakes, superior handling and the AT was fantastic. And to seal the deal, I got heated-leather, sat-radio, 6CD, rain-sensing wipers, 17' 5-spoke alloys LED-lights etc for the same price as the Civic's cloth-seats (leather wasn't even an option), single CD deck, 16's.
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Howard Kerr 12:04PM (3/11/2007)
As a Honda/Acura owner who has now owned 4 of these cars and driven several more, I agree with S. Dumas. When I remember my 4th gen Civic and my 5th gen Civic, I can see where Honda moved the refinement target up just a little more with each suceeding model. Having driven a N600, an early '70s Civic, and a few '80s Accords......it's hard to believe the car building part of this company has only been around for about 40 years.
HOWEVER, as much as I agree with carnut that Honda has problems with their newer automatic transmissions (the one in my Integra has, I believe, 159,000 miles on it and still runs with almost no problems...hey, it's 16 years old!) he very nicely forgets about the problems Chrysler had in the late '80s and '90s with their automatics. Or the many stories reported by AutoBlog about the problems Ford had/has? with automatics in their trucks. Hell, if I remember right, even "mighty" Toyota has had automatic transmission problems.
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Avinash machado 12:13PM (3/11/2007)
Honda should look into buying a small specialist manufacturer like TVR or Lotus. It would be great for its image.
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Matt 4:00PM (3/11/2007)
"If only they could figure out the mysteries of design and torque."
SO TRUE. Ahaha.
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Steven T. 12:21PM (3/11/2007)
"I think we can count on the V10 supercar being a big contributor to their sales volumes. Except that other news reports say they've gone back to the drawing board with it."
Um, is that a typo? A V10 a big sales contributor? In an era of shaky gas prices and a growing public outcry about an increasingly silly horsepower race? It really doesn't matter how great of an engineering marvel Honda comes up with -- a V10 is a good five to 10 years too late.
This is but one example of how Honda is going in the wrong direction. Another example: I'm a diehard Civic owner but wouldn't consider purchasing the lastest generation. Too big, glitzy and unversatile in its packaging. The Fit is more like an old Civic, but it's ugly and too loaded bells and whistles that I don't want in an economy car.
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AR 12:58PM (3/11/2007)
"Sorry, but a TRANSMISSION is a major part of the car and after all these years, Honda still can't build them right. Ask an 04 TL owner how their trans is holding up. Same old same old."
Ask me. I own a 2000 Acura 1.6 EL with 242,000 km and have experienced no transmission problems whatsoever. Sorry to rain on your anti-import parade.
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Bill 1:48PM (3/11/2007)
#3 Stephane is right on the mark.
I was a Honda freak in the 1980's. Hondas were special then, relative to the rest of the market. In the 90's I got turned off to them, they had become dull and mainstream, and I wasn't particularly entralled with my 91 Civic.
When I got my new 2002 Protege5, I felt it had some of the spirit in it that Hondas had lost, but it was still well built and reliable. I feel the same about my 06 Mazda3.
I'm a fan of diesels, so it is possible that Honda could win me back if they bring a diesel car like the UK 5-door Civic to the US market, but right now there is nothing in the Honda showroom that remotely appeals to me personally.
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Tom Design 1:55PM (3/11/2007)
I just received a safety notice to schedule a "shop half day" for my 2007 Honda Fit Sport Auto. The airbag computer software may make the bags deploy early. Is this a recall? I like my car, the handling, and interior finish and packaging. It is a utilitarian delight as on accessible box with the "magic" seats. On one highway trip it hit a 40mpg average. The negatives are many, however. The engine is raucous, harsh and strained at acceleration, the exhaust is so noisy at idle that I thought a clamp had opened, the tranny makes loud erratic clunking noises shifting between reverse/drive gears, the front visibility just drops off making it impossible to judge the bumper corners, the A-pillar blocks 4 inches of visibility (I almost clipped a jogger on a left turn!), the actual city mileage is a disappointment at 19-23mpg, the ABS applies on dry surfaces early, highway wind noise is loud (the dry blower at the car wash makes the entire roof ripple and pound like a tin roof in a tornado), the car is very stripped in ways, no carpeting, hard plastic door handles and door arm rests, cheap dome light, no center arm rest, no rain drip gutters, no available sunroof, instrument stalks with clumsy multiple functions.
After owning and driving for 6 months I have to ask is my car better than Suzuki, Aveo, Cobalt, Versa, Kias, G5, etc? I'm not convinced from behind the wheel.
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Barney 2:28PM (3/11/2007)
In Canada Honda is a big hit. Reliability and good on gas brings it ahead of even Toyota. The moment, Honda and Toyota forget why people buy their cars, they will have Hyundai to contend with, as Stéphane Dumas mentioned. Also price plays a very big factor with or without gadgets.
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far jr 3:16PM (3/11/2007)
Tom Design... the Fit shows no recalls on most sites I checked. Maybe the recall is new enough that it is not listed yet. Of course it maybe a hidden Honda service kiss to avoid an actual recall. You know... gotta preserve that quality reputation. Why is this "highly acclaimed" car only selling a little over 200 per month?
seriously Honda builds some of the best. But I'm not sure that Honda is a real threat.
Civic sales down 24 percent this year vs. same period last year... Come on, it's brand new for crying out loud! Down 24 percent?
S2000 sales down 47 percent vs. same period last year. Is it the ancient design or the introduction of Sky and Solstice?
Element sales down 17.5 percent vs. same period last year.
Ridgeline sales down 17.4 percent vs. same period last year.
Pilot down 7.5 percent vs. same period last year. Could the Outlook and Acadia be stealing some sales?
Acua is about the same...
TL down 22.6%
TSX down 10.1%
RL down 45.4%
The old Accord is up right before it gets a redesign. Are there rebates to go along with this?
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far jr 3:21PM (3/11/2007)
I ment to state that the Fit sells a little over 2000 per month (2,301 to be exact). Two hundred would put it more into Land Cruiser sales territory!
Oh and before all of the "liar, redneck, xenophobe" comments, I will list my source for those numbers... Honda's own site.
http://www.hondanews.com/categories/1090/releases/390
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JarryHames 5:06PM (3/11/2007)
Honda still makes a great car. I think that there are no perfect cars out there. If you look close enough, you'll find something to complain about every manufacturer and their products. I still think that Honda is one of the better manufacturers on the market. We've owned a Toyota, a Mazda, a Nissan and 5 Accords. The Hondas have been the best vehicles in our driveway. Our '95 Accord Coupe was the only one that was a POS. Since then my '93, '98 and '01 are all running like they were new. The '93 still starting to show its age with over 150,000 miles. Go Honda and can't wait to see the new Accord!
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BOB 6:43PM (3/11/2007)
,,,,,,DESIGN!!
If they could get the Accord looking right (new 2008 coming), they would sell even more. Civic went from fuddy-duddy to space-ship in the newest coupe -- none of the "perfect" companies are perfect, just better than the others.
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