Filed under: Etc., Hirings/Firings/Layoffs, Plants/Manufacturing, Hyundai, Toyota
Automaker Smackdown: Hyundai vs. Toyota
So, you're Hyundai. You badly covet more market share in the US, and your targets are Honda and Toyota. What would be better than to hire a defector from the other team? It's even better when the defector brings along plenty of top-secret information to share. That's just what engineer Bruce Shibuya did when Hyundai nabbed him from Toyota and appointed him vice president of the Hyundai-Kia North American Quality Center. Little details like non-disclosure agreements must have been lost in the shuffle, as a tipster inside Hyundai alerted Toyota to the blatant theft and disclosure of trade secrets, which of course has led to a lawyer-fest. Shibuya's alleged brazen acts included giving Toyota-branded powerpoint presentations to Hyundai and copying binder upon binder of technical information, all handily marked "do not duplicate", and sending that information on to Hyundai HQ in Korea. Since Toyota's lawyers arrived on the scene, Shibuya has been terminated and Toyota has yet to file litigation against Hyundai.
[Source: Automotive News - Sub. Required]
_opt_thumbnail.jpg)
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 3)
Father Time 12:09PM (11/27/2006)
Payback is a bitch, ain't it Tiyodee.
Reply
Bob 12:19PM (11/27/2006)
Has Bruce Shibuya taken a business class in his life? Did he really think Toyota wouldn't find out?? Yikes.
Reply
Angry Bob 12:24PM (11/27/2006)
Love those power point presentations! Just bought a 2007 Toyota XLE and don't know if I like it all that well, but at the price think I'd better like it. Don't know what else is out there that I'd like better, though - just not happy with any of them. Always bought Buick before, but had major problems with each of them before 60,000 miles - air conditioning, master cylinder, transmission.
Reply
RC 12:27PM (11/27/2006)
can hyundai ever come up with an original design? NO. And now this.
Reply
Glenn 12:34PM (11/27/2006)
Well, my first Hyundai (a 2002 Sonata V6) will be my last. This simply confirms a decision I was considering.
I've had a mystery no-start issue with the Sonata which took 5-6 visits to the dealer during which one of the visits they told me it was $350 worth of spark plugs and spark plug wires. Not warrantee covered.
Nope that wasn't it. I said (half jokingly - half not) well then, how about $350 off my next new car? I spent this money on good faith at your mechanic's suggestion and the problem wasn't fixed? Blank stares.
So finally the car is fixed - just 2000 miles BEFORE the warrantee is finished. It was the ECM (what would THAT have cost me in 2001 miles? $1000?). A bad ground. No "diagnostic messages" were coming through.
Nope. My 2005 Toyota Prius - easily the MOST complex automobile built in the world - is TOTALLY reliable.
Then Hyundai pull this sh!t? No, thanks. I want to buy cars from a reputable company, not a "typical enron type company".
Hyundai (and their 50% owned Kia affiliate) are officially on my do-not-buy list. Forever. Just like GM, Ford, DXC and VW-Audi.
Honda FCX? Yep, I want one in 2008. Another Toyota? Yep, this Prius of mine most certainly won't be my last.
Reply
Bob 12:56PM (11/27/2006)
Glenn, why the heck did you post all of that here?
Also, Hyundais are significantly better than they were even in 2002. And besides that, the dealer deserves the blame for 5 of those 6 trips since they didn't know what they were doing. I had to deal with 5 trips to my awful Toyota dealer to get them to replace the BCM on my '01 Camry. I guess I should never buy a Toyota again by your reasoning.
Reply
D Man 1:02PM (11/27/2006)
Toyota is getting TOO BIG, their quality is going down; if you don't believe, LOOK AT THE RECALLS!! Hyundai are inexpensive cars, nice cross over SUV's but I am still weary! Stealing secrets, thats the AMERICAN way, how many times has that happened among yourselves. honda are nice cars, OVERPRICED. I think NISSAN is they way to go, better styling, and their quality is going up! Foret about buying AMERICAN, unless you want a HD truck!
Reply
Brian 1:26PM (11/27/2006)
lol. I don't understand why people bring their baised anecdotes in here especially when they are COMPLETELY OFF TOPIC.
First, I always thought Hyundai's designs were unique. Previous Elantra, Sonata, and Accent were not copies at all. Now that the automaker's designs are more mainstream, I can see some benchmarking of market leaders in design.
Second, my 2003 Hyundai Elantra has not had one problem. Does that mean anything?
Finally and back on topic, I've noticed Hyundai/Kia stealing alot of talent from its competitors in recent years. It should be interesting how this will affect their designs and quality in the next few years.
Reply
Bob 1:28PM (11/27/2006)
D Man wins the "I brought up Toyota recalls for no reason" award! Congrats!
I wonder for how many years their '05 recalls will get brought up. Because so far they've had very few in '06.
Reply
Wilhelmina J. Higginbotham 1:34PM (11/27/2006)
Glenn, nobody cares about you and your stupid Tioyotas!
I am sick of this crap.
Why do you guys post here?
All you do is shop for appliances to clog the roads with.
You don't like cars--or anything automotive.
You wouldn't know automotive passion if it hit you between the eyes.
Just go away already!
Buy your Camry or Accord if that is what floats your boat, but stay away from REAL car guys!
Us car guys will deal with our VWs, TVRs and whatever else makes us happy.
If "reliable' is the only reason you exist, you should consider moving to a city and taking the bus.
They are even MORE reliable that Toyota.
Reply
Michael Karesh 1:49PM (11/27/2006)
If this happened all the time, then we'd hear more about it. Last big case I recall was when Lopez took GM documents to VW back in the early 1990s. Ended up losing his job, and VW settled by agreeing to buy $700m in parts from GM.
Reply
menice 2:19PM (11/27/2006)
whatever, car mans. ripe from and off each other constantly, even tag lines are same phrase reworded..
cool, good grab Hyundai!! Bravo. just
too bad you couldn't get Aston Martins lead guy or someone cool, like a BMW defector.
AND please dont start designing nasty humped nosed cars!!
Reply
DDao 4:07PM (11/27/2006)
Wilhelmina J. Higginbotham - you must be one of those diehard VAG fan as I was...VW/AUDI or die!!!! I dont care if my car is worth nothing in a couple years, at least it has SOUL. pfft..i'll pass...i've owned a german car since i was 16 and guess what? I drive a Tacoma Truck and love this toaster. I wont ever have to worry about a coilpack going out on my 12k mile 01 A4, fuel pump dying on my 15k mile on my 03 Audi A4 or window regulators going out either. But yah you got your FAST...enjoy it while i putt along in my toaster.
Back on topic, yes this stuff goes on in business all the time, but this guy is high up and should have known better than to do it blatantly. I think Hyundia knew that hiring some guy like and paying him well he would feel the need to share his knowledge...or at least his former employer's knowledge.
Reply
RayRay 4:21PM (11/27/2006)
Maybe Toyota planted the guy in Hyundai so he could infect their processes with a bunch of misinformation.
Reply
Bill Maher is an Idiot 4:25PM (11/27/2006)
Don't care for either, but I'd pick a Toyota over a Hyundai anyday.
Reply
sp 4:36PM (11/27/2006)
explains why new Elantra looks so much like Corolla, lol
Reply
Steve 5:01PM (11/27/2006)
This is one of those high-profile cases of industrial espionage.
Hyundai could not compete so it wanted a short cut and that means infiltrating the enemies (competitors) defenses, acquiring the knowledge through espionage and using the opponents force against it.
Doing it is one thing, doing it without getting caught is another. Toyota better have a strong counter espionage network for the future is going to be even tougher.
Reply
lintondoza 6:04PM (11/27/2006)
This news is ironic as the review in the latest Car and Driver gave these two cars very similar reviews.
Reply
doglet 6:20PM (11/27/2006)
this is nothing new, companies hire away people mainly for information all the time.
even with the lawyer-field day hyundai is likely to come out ahead. it sounds like generic corporate speak but you hear it a lot because its true, toyota will have to continue to innovate if it wants to say ahead. it doesnt take long for everyone else to catch up and if you dont have the advantages you did a few years ago your market share starts to dwindle and your excess capacity becomes a burdin and your GM.
Reply
wtf? 7:04PM (11/27/2006)
Glenn, aren't you the guy who said you rented a Kia Sedona and said it sucked??
You seem to have a lot of faith for a hyundai hater.
I think it's easier to admit that you work 4 Toyota
Reply