Mosler announces first production car with carbon fiber wheels
Mosler Automotive has announced that the company's MT900S will be the first production vehicle to be factory-equipped with carbon fiber wheels. Mosler gave the nod to wheel and composite technology specialists Dymag to develop the 18- and 20-inch magnesium/composite wheels for its mid-engined supercar.
Dymag has offered composite motorcycle wheels for some time, but the Mosler is the first production car to carry the lightweight rollers. And we mean light - the Mosler's front wheels come in at 14 pounds, and the rear wheels at 17.5 pounds, making each wheel more than 10 pounds lighter than the OZ forged aluminum wheels they replace. Given such a sizeable reduction in unsprung weight, fortunate buyers can expect huge dynamic benefits in almost every aspect of the car's on-road performance, particularly because the MT900S weighs just 2,450 pounds (1,950 pounds in the "Photon" version).
[Source: Sports Car Market]
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Hernan 11:54AM (5/19/2006)
I seem to remember a crappy Chrysler back in the late 80's with some sort of synthetic wheel material. This was back when they took their 3rd rate FWD cars, put turbo chargers on their tiny 4 bangers and a wing in the back. Wait that sounds familiar.
I will try to look it up.
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Michael 11:58AM (5/19/2006)
That's great... but don't forget the weight of the tires. The wheels could weigh nothing (versus 14 pounds) and the car's dynamics might not change all that much.
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Paul 12:03PM (5/19/2006)
Dodge Shadow, by Shelby had the nonmetal wheels.
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Hernan 12:19PM (5/19/2006)
Damn that was hard to find. Chrylser's Shelby GLHS rode on compressed fiberglass wheels.
http://www.shelbyregistry.com/pages/89csx.html
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Mosler isn't production... 12:25PM (5/19/2006)
Mosler cars don't count as production cars. They're hand-made from Vettes basically.
It'll be interesting to see how this turns out. The weight savings are great, but I'm afraid of the failure mode. Seems kinda odd that even F1 doesn't use this tech.
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Noah 12:41PM (5/19/2006)
I'm so glad to see this.
GM could offer it as an option on the Devil in a Blue Dress... sure there are other things that could be lighter but gosh, COOL!
--Noah
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Anders 12:42PM (5/19/2006)
The Koenigsegg CCX have carbon fiber wheels:
"The optional industry first carbon fibre wheels save another 3 kg per wheel compared to the already lightweight magnesium wheels that come as standard."
http://www.koenigsegg.com/thecars/ccx.asp?ccx=2
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David 1:04PM (5/19/2006)
Question. In a world of 18, 19 and 20 inch wheels on performance cars, what is the performance edge gained by having the larger wheels given that they add unsprung weight? Is there a positive tradeoff or are these wheels all about style?
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Corey W. 1:17PM (5/19/2006)
Ok, how would these wheels take a Detroit pothole at 45MPH?
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Jazz Drummer 1:34PM (5/19/2006)
Thanks #5!!!! Koenigsegg offers, as an option, the "worlds first" Carbon Fiber magnesium wheel for the New CCX in 19 and 20 inch configurations.. NOT Mosler....
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ZoomZoomin' 1:47PM (5/19/2006)
"Question. In a world of 18, 19 and 20 inch wheels on performance cars, what is the performance edge gained by having the larger wheels given that they add unsprung weight? Is there a positive tradeoff or are these wheels all about style?"
Room for brakes...VERY big brake rotors and calipers.
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Calvin 1:55PM (5/19/2006)
Larger and wider wheels with lower profile tires allow for larger contact patched potentially, thereby increasing grip which is important.
The flip side is higher unsprung weight and more drag.
In either case, the wheels and tires are part of the suspension package. As long as the car was designed and engineered with them, then it'll work. But attempts to put wheels and tires that are not matched to the rest of the suspension would not.
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ZoomZoomin' 2:34PM (5/19/2006)
"Ok, how would these wheels take a Detroit pothole at 45MPH?"
Not a problem...if you lived in Detroit, those wheels wouldn't be on your car for very long.
On a more serious note, yeah...denting your rims would no longer be as much of a concern as them completely shattering into ultra sharp+tough shards. Hopefully the spare tire kit comes with stainless steel gloves. Realistically, these would seem to be for the track even if mounted on a street-legal vehicle.
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Mason 3:08PM (5/19/2006)
Hey David, on high performance vehicles there are definitely benefits to having a larger rim especially in high performance applications.
#1. larger rims provide room for larger brake calipers and rotors for slowing down all those hi-po ponies
#2. Larger contact patch on the road for connecting big power to the ground.
But %99 of the time, people are reducing the performance on standard cars with big rims.
If you have a light car and no need for big brake rotors, then you hurt performance with big rims
Hope that helps
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cvn 3:23PM (5/19/2006)
Like it was said above, the Koenigsegg's already got them. GTFO MOSLER
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Scott 4:11PM (5/19/2006)
#7:
I'm sure the wheels would be fine. Carbon fiber is stronger than steel.
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m 5:04PM (5/19/2006)
SSR7 wheels weigh less than 20lbs per wheel i forget the specific model. you can find them or tire rack.
David you pose a great question though. Especially considering that if you want straight up acceleration, having a thicker sidewall is better, gives you more grip without hopping.
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GT 5:07PM (5/19/2006)
In response to the question of larger wheels versus performance: This reminds me of an interesting interview with the head of Bridgestone tires' F1 program. In F1, they are regulated to 13" wheels. He was asked about the performance advantage of using 17-18" wheels as many sports car racing series use. His replyed that a human might not be able to drive such a F1 car at the limit!
So, yes there is an advantage with larger brake rotors and handling dynamics, if the car is designed for it.
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GT 5:12PM (5/19/2006)
#11:
Carbon Fiber is stronger than steel, but it is typically more britle. Without giving a crash course in mechanical/materials engineering, a wheel versus pothole isn't a pure strength test. In an impact Carbon Fibre tends to shatter, whereas steel would just bend. Strengh is an almost static measurement, the sample is slowly loaded until yield stress is reached and finally failure. If you took the same material to an impact strength test, it basicaly is hit with a large hammer. Material results vary in interesting ways...
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Rob O'Daniel 8:21PM (5/19/2006)
I wonder just how significant saving 40 lbs (10 pounds lighter per wheel) really is. And besides, it sort seems like shaving 40 lbs off of the suspension would be less effective than reducing that same amount elsewhere...
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